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    stats whats best

    so i know that most best is Damage, crit chance, Crit damage,
    then mag size,

    my question what would ya want on a normal non-elemental gun, damage, or Damage to afflicted Targets" and what is that really mean?
    Last edited by blackpelt; 01-04-2018, 10:50 PM. Reason: stats weapon

    #2
    Ask 10 people you're liable to get 10 different answers. Here's mine:

    Crit Chance and Crit Damage need each other to be effective. if you have a 10% base Crit Chance and get an Orange roll for 60% Crit Damage that's only 6% DPS which is less than a white Damage roll which gives close enough to face value of 10%. Firerate is direct boosts to DPS and that is face value in terms of burst damage but when you factor in the need to reload more often it's not face value in terms of sustained DPS (DPS that includes reload times) and it uses more resources for that DPS increase. Reload and Magazine also boost DPS, but don't boost ammo efficiency in any way.

    If you get Crit Chance and Crit Damage to work in conjunction well enough it's probably the best you can do. If for instance your gun has a 10% base Crit Chance and a 75% base Crit Damage and you have 42% Crit Chance from 2 Crit rolls of 21% and then get a 60% Crit Damage and a 45% Crit Damage roll you'd end up with 52% Crit Chance and a 180% that's effectively 94% additional DPS, but to the actual weapon now take a full Damage Rolled gun you could get 100 with all orange rolls, but that's not too likely, but let's call it even rarities since my example only used 4 of 5 slots leaving room for an element it's 3 blue and 1 orange damage perks or 65% damage now if you take it at full face value which of course it actually isn't since it's additive with a few mechanics, but multiplicative with base you'd turn a 100 damage gun into 165 damage gun or 65% increase in DPS which is noticeably lower than Crit Chance and Crit Damage working in conjunction, but since Crit Chance and Crit Damage factor in the base you then have to factor in the base Crit Chance and Crit Damage into the new base of the gun which actually yield 7.5% higher running off the base so Damage is multiplicative with the DPS afforded from Crits whereas the Crit stats are additive with the DPS afforded from Crits now with the 7.5% expected DPS from Crits you actually have 77.3% increased damage which is still noticeably lower than the Crit stats working in unison which resulted in 94% expected DPS boost from Crits.

    Basically in terms of a single stat Damage is king if and only if the headshot modifier is low enough that the additive bonus results in a number that is less significant than the multiplicative bonus of Damage with Headshots since Damage is applied first. Id Est 20% Damage with a 500% headshot modifier would result in a 100 dmg gun dealing 5x 120 damage or 720 damage (120 x 6 since it's 500% additional damage so you always add 100% to the actual number) whereas if you have a 30% headshot modifier on the same gun a 100 dmg gun would deal 630 damage (100 x 6.3) so even though the headshot number is larger in terms of mods it's damage can potentially be less. *500% is an extreme case ofcourse but it can come into play at lower values particularly when dealing with modifiers that are much closer than the 10% gap I used) If you want an overall best weapon then it's probably Crit Chance and Crit Damage working in unison.

    To answer the second part of your question Affliction deals 10% of your weapons BASE Damage per second for 6 seconds Id Est 60% of your weapon's BASE damage and is subject to elemental weaknesses/advantages and crits and can also scale off some abilities like Debilitating Shots.

    Best weapon would probably be 2 orange crit chances with 2 orange crit damage with an affliction element, but good luck getting that. A close runner up would likely be an affliction element with 4 orange damage to afflicted targets, but again good luck with that one

    Orange Crit Damage = 60%
    Orange Crit Chance = 28%
    Orange Damage to Afflicted Targets = 30% (I think I never rolled an Orange conditional Damage yet)

    56% Crit Chance + 120% Crit Damage = 67.2%, but you need to add in the bases for the weapon. Minimum is 5% at a +50% damage I believe so 103.7% DPS (sustained any given shot could not crit and change a one shot to a two shot so in that sense damage is more consistent since if the damage breaks the threshold you'll always break the threshold and kill in one shot)
    103.7% x 10% (Affliction raises damage by 10%) x Base + 60% Base x 103.7%
    assume 100 base damage
    224.07 + 122.22 = 346.29

    4x Damage to Afflicted = 120%, but requires the first shot to trigger and Damage to Afflicted shouldn't boost the actual affliction damage whereas Crit will.
    120% x 10% x Base + 60% Base
    242 + 60 = 302
    If Affliction Damage is boosted by Damage to Afflicted Targets then it'd be 362, but again I don't think it is Crit Chance would wins out not to mention you have to apply that first chance to get a bonus that sets you back a little especially on weak husks.

    Firerate is prolly up there, but I don't particularly want to do the calculation for every possible combination. Me I'd opt for straight Damage rolls, good ol generic damage rolls, it won't be the top damage you can obtain by any means, but it wouldn't be bad and could save you a bullet or two on the weaker husks which actually would serve to increase it's effective sustained DPS over a group of mobs to the point it probably would beat out a stronger sustained DPS gun. Note that you also have to consider the type of weapon you're using, one round in the magazine you need Reload to shoot faster and Reload has diminishing returns so you'd need some sort of mix there maybe +60% Reload, +Energy Affliction, 3x +20% Damage since if it's one in the mag it's prolly intended to kill on that first shot so you want to boost it's base right away and try to break a thresh hold with that first shot than optimizing the second shot since if it needs a second shot it probably won't need enough to make that Damage to Afflicted worthwhile.
    Last edited by Dwlr; 01-04-2018, 11:54 PM.

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      #3
      I really love critchance on swords. I got a stormblade with 92% kritchance and its pretty nice.The most swords have a 120% Damagebonus on critical hits. With your passive heroslots u can boost it to 190%. That means you deal close to 3x of the base Damage and thats the reason why I think that swords are underrated.

      Comment


        #4
        fyi Element Affliction always comes with 2-greys, 1-blue and 2-oj rolls. Element non-affliction and weapon-dmg affliction are blue rolls and the first perk of a weapon cannot be a orange.

        So theoretically an energy weapon with no Element Affliction would have the chance to combine four orange perks for highest dps?
        Last edited by Fortnit; 01-06-2018, 05:36 PM.

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          #5
          Originally posted by Fortnit View Post
          fyi Element Affliction always comes with 2-greys, 1-blue and 2-oj rolls. Element non-affliction and weapon-dmg affliction are blue rolls and the first perk of a weapon cannot be a orange.

          So theoretically an energy weapon with no Element Affliction would have the chance to combine four orange perks for highest dps?
          Unless they've officially made that statement as part of the mechanics you, even as a whale don't have a large enough sample size to make that statement. Absence of proof != proof of absence. All swans were white was considered a fact before the Black Swans showed up after all..

          Comment


            #6
            Ugh... some bad advice ITT.

            For example: crit chance and crit damage do not have to be together at all. You can get inherent +crit chance/dmg buffs from your support slots, so a weapon with, say, just crit dmg can actually be very useful even if it's base crit chance is only 5%.

            Of course, matching is better, but weapons do not exist in vacuum.

            Originally posted by Dwlr View Post

            Unless they've officially made that statement as part of the mechanics you, even as a whale don't have a large enough sample size to make that statement. Absence of proof != proof of absence. All swans were white was considered a fact before the Black Swans showed up after all..
            According to my gear and the gear of people Ive checked, this is actually correct.

            Can you prove otherwise? Even if they can exist in a different fashion this seems to be true of the vast majority of rolls.
            Last edited by astheoceansblue; 01-13-2018, 04:17 AM.

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by astheoceansblue View Post
              Ugh... some bad advice ITT.

              For example: crit chance and crit damage do not have to be together at all. You can get inherent +crit chance/dmg buffs from your support slots, so a weapon with, say, just crit dmg can actually be very useful even if it's base crit chance is only 5%.

              Of course, matching is better, but weapons do not exist in vacuum.



              According to my gear and the gear of people Ive checked, this is actually correct.

              Can you prove otherwise? Even if they can exist in a different fashion this seems to be true of the vast majority of rolls.
              He was asking for the best if they're not together they're NOT the best so it's not bad advice. You realize that with a 5% Crit Chance that a 60% bonus to crit damage is only a mere 3% DPS boost right when you could roll an Orange Damage Perk that gives 20% DPS.

              Again read what you're actually quoting, you're falling into the fool's argument, Absence of proof != proof of absence, just because something appears true it does not magically make it a fact like. It doesn't matter if it appears correct you cannot make the statement, if a single weapon out there breaks the trend then the statement is automatically false and you can't possibly know if somebody has a weapon out there that doesn't follow the trend.

              I don't have to prove otherwise and I never said it wasn't the trend, again read what you've quoted. You can't make the statement that they ALWAYS come that way and even less so with just a statistically insignificant number of data points, further more unless you actually looked at EVERY SINGLE weapon you still wouldn't be make the statement as an absolute only one with a margin of error which would be your confidence interval. All mine follow the trend, but yet again I simply said that unless they actually released it's impossible to be outside the trend you can state it as an absolute as he did.

              Comment


                #8
                IT is bad advice because you don't mention the fact I did, so ultimately your advice is incorrect.

                Your arrogance and obnoxious manner doesn't help your quest anyway, the point I made was perfectly reasonable and a reasonable person would have acknowledged this instead of the obnoxious tirade you posted in response.

                Also much of your advice on min-max is just plain wrong, lol. Better people have made better analysis and breakdowns. :)

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by astheoceansblue View Post
                  IT is bad advice because you don't mention the fact I did, so ultimately your advice is incorrect.

                  Your arrogance and obnoxious manner doesn't help your quest anyway, the point I made was perfectly reasonable and a reasonable person would have acknowledged this instead of the obnoxious tirade you posted in response.

                  Also much of your advice on min-max is just plain wrong, lol. Better people have made better analysis and breakdowns. :)
                  Like I said in the other thread you're going around spamming you're clearly a troll, you recommend White Sushi like a little fanboy then try to contradict him moments later sometimes in the same thread. No it's not bad advice it specifically says if you're looking for the best they need to work in conjunction by themselves Crit Chance and Crit Damage are both sub-par. Yet again obvious troll is obvious.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Haha, I said WS was a better analyst than you, I didn't say I agree with everything he claims.

                    Your language when speaking about these things is flawed, you /need/ to mention the rest of the game when considering what to use as things don't exist in a vacuum.

                    Also, you're horribly obnoxious with your tone etc... which is why no one here likes you or listens to you even if you occasionally do have good advice.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by astheoceansblue View Post
                      Haha, I said WS was a better analyst than you, I didn't say I agree with everything he claims.

                      Your language when speaking about these things is flawed, you /need/ to mention the rest of the game when considering what to use as things don't exist in a vacuum.

                      Also, you're horribly obnoxious with your tone etc... which is why no one here likes you or listens to you even if you occasionally do have good advice.
                      He has a google doc that is full of misinformation and flawed calculations, anybody can make a google doc and be wrong if that does it for you go ahead, but clearly you think I actually care what you think since you claim he's better and yet have disagreed with his opinion EVERY SINGLE time you've posted. I'll let you in on a little secret I don't care who's fanboy you claim to be the only reason I'm bothering to respond to obvious trolling is that people who don't know any better might actually listen to you thinking it's legitimate advice and not simply you waging a popularity contest against me. They're free to listen to your propaganda in the end, but my conscience is clear, they have the CORRECT information should they choose to listen, taking bad advice from a troll like you is entirely on them.

                      No it's not. The thread is an idyllic scenario something you seem to not be able to comprehend that you can ignore the game first and foremost secondly if you actually bothered to read and actually had the ability to understand you'd realize that you're just plain wrong with you post. If Crit Damage and Crit Chance are separated they're SUB-PAR plain and simple, but working together no other perks are better in terms of boosting DPS. My statement stands and yours holds no water.

                      Troll harder, they're free to take terrible advice from the likes of you if they so choose, they'll be worse off for it and it's not skin off my hide. Right is right, right isn't a popularity contest so I really don't care if people like me or not, so like I said you're going to have to troll harder than you are.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Originally posted by Dwlr View Post
                        He has a google doc that is full of misinformation and flawed calculations, anybody can make a google doc and be wrong if that does it for you go ahead, but clearly you think I actually care what you think since you claim he's better and yet have disagreed with his opinion EVERY SINGLE time you've posted. I'll let you in on a little secret I don't care who's fanboy you claim to be the only reason I'm bothering to respond to obvious trolling is that people who don't know any better might actually listen to you thinking it's legitimate advice and not simply you waging a popularity contest against me. They're free to listen to your propaganda in the end, but my conscience is clear, they have the CORRECT information should they choose to listen, taking bad advice from a troll like you is entirely on them.

                        No it's not. The thread is an idyllic scenario something you seem to not be able to comprehend that you can ignore the game first and foremost secondly if you actually bothered to read and actually had the ability to understand you'd realize that you're just plain wrong with you post. If Crit Damage and Crit Chance are separated they're SUB-PAR plain and simple, but working together no other perks are better in terms of boosting DPS. My statement stands and yours holds no water.

                        Troll harder, they're free to take terrible advice from the likes of you if they so choose, they'll be worse off for it and it's not skin off my hide. Right is right, right isn't a popularity contest so I really don't care if people like me or not, so like I said you're going to have to troll harder than you are.
                        I haven't disagreed with his opinion every time I've posted, and it doesn't make it true because you use CAPS. Also many of your opinions simply don't align with the min-max reality.

                        And man, you really are an unpleasant poster to read.

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