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Has anyone tried UT2341?

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  • Has anyone tried UT2341?

    For those that haven't seen it, it's mod for UT2004 from ~2014 geared at restoring UT99 gameplay, with new UT99-style weapon models to complete the experience:

    From what I can tell only speaking English, it's what this guy is playing in all his videos, though he seems to have added UT99 player models and some other things:

    Anyway I was pleasantly surprised by it. What I like is that it feels closer to my rose-colored memories of UT99 than how UT99 actually plays in reality. Things are a little tighter, there's a little more visual clarity in certain areas, and it removes a few of the pet peaves that always bugged me like:

    - In UT99 the shock beam visual moves like a projectile, even though the damage is hitscan. The impact effect does give an instantaneous and accurate visual que, but I still find the slow travel of the visual beam extremely distracting. It makes me want to lead the beam even though that would result in a miss, and results in an overal bad feel and bad sensation to the weapon. The mod doesn't have this problem; the beam looks instantaneous and feels a lot better to shot.

    - Flak chunks in this mod look and move like UT99 flak chunks, but they won't damage you after falling to the ground, so you won't randomly die to old flak chunks sitting around like bio globs. This wasn't something that happened constantly in UT99 but I still find it really annoying to go back to, so it's really nice to have it gone.

    The movement also feels a lot closer to the real UT99 than other attempts to merely disable dodge-jump in UT2k4. Of course, it's not an absolutely perfect recreation of UT99 gameplay because the player scale to map ratio still isn't quite right, even on very accurate remakes of UT99 maps. Still, if this mod had arrived circa 2005 it could have saved us a lot of hours tolerating UT2k4's less flattering gameplay features.
    Last edited by Gnalvl; 07-26-2017, 02:29 PM.

  • #2
    It's decent but incomplete. Worked on that for a while, but it had team issues.
    HABOUJI! Ouboudah! Batai d'va!
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    • #3
      Originally posted by Sir_Brizz View Post
      It's decent but incomplete. Worked on that for a while, but it had team issues.
      Yeah after playing with it some more and also looking at the source code, it's far from perfect. Unless there is something in the mutator class I missed which says otherwise, it seems like whoever set the base weapon values incorrectly assumed that UT1 Hardcore's 1.1x time acceleration wasn't carried over to 2k4. Consequently they are entering compensated 110% projectile velocities which then get boosted by an additional 10% by the game engine.

      I actually don't mind this as I always wished UT99's projectiles were a bit faster. But if you want an authentic UT99 experience, it's a bit off (again, unless they built 10% speed reduction in the mutator somewhere and I missed it).

      I would be curious to try porting over this gravity scaling to regular UT2k4 movement. I think it would remove a lot of the "floatiness" which has probably been incorrectly blamed on the dodge-jumping itself, and gets closer to the movement feel of i.e. Toxikk which I don't mind as much. It would take some trial and error to increase dodge velocity so you can still cross all the same distances as the default game, but then you'd have non-floaty movement that works on all the regular UT2k4 maps (whereas UT2341 breaks the connectivity on tons of maps, even many UT99 remakes, which with jumps designed for 2k4 movement).
      Last edited by Gnalvl; 07-17-2017, 02:22 PM.


      • #4
        Sounds reasonable for movement. I'm not sure what makes UT3/Toxikk movement feel more flat. The numbers for most of the things like gravity and such are exactly the same, though I seem to remember some being slightly modified.

        Also, pretty funny what you found about the 1.1x scaling. I never noticed that
        HABOUJI! Ouboudah! Batai d'va!
        BeyondUnreal - Liandri Archives [An extensive repository of Unreal lore.] - Join us on IRC [ - #beyondunreal]


        • #5
          I don't know what this mod does to gravity, but UT99 and 2k4 have the same gravity value. That said 2k4 also has 10% faster running speed so one could argue the gravity is relatively lower compared to movement speeds. From that perspective UT99 has 10% higher gravity although things still fall at the same speed in both games.
          UT3 does have a higher gravity value by about 9.5%. It also has the 2k4 movement speeds though, so if you were to use that as a measure again they would cancel out and UT99 and UT3 would virtually equalize.

          I think most people would still say 2k4 feels lower gravity than UT99 and UT3 feels like higher, so both the objective value and the gravity vs movement speed ratio don't tell the whole story. The feel is likely influenced by numerous things like movement capabilities, jump speed, character scale, eye height, map scale and audio feedback.

          Incidentally, if you measure the UT4 ratio of gravity to its running speed you'll get UT99/UT3 as having 14% higher gravity. A good bit lower gravity than 2k4, at least in this particular comparison.


          • #6
            Yeah I'm not really sure if increasing gravity in UT2k4 objectively makes it closer to UT99 movement or not, but I'm pretty sure it will bring it closer to UT3 and Toxikk. If you use the dodge-jump mutator in UT3 it still doesn't feel as floaty as UT2k4... In addition to the 9.5% higher gravity, I think it has to do with the scaling - characters feel larger within smaller structures, so the height and distance gained from an "equal" jump feel less. By contrast, 2k4's small characters within large maps make it feel like you're floating "for miles" when you cross a sprawling hallway in just a few bounds.

            Certainly changing the gravity in UT2k4 won't fix the scaling issues but it still might get somewhat closer to the feel of dodge-jumping in UT3 or Toxikk, which I prefer.