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    Originally posted by Wail View Post
    [...]
    1. Unfortunately you are unable to see how your own position undermines itself, since if it's okay to completely disregard the concept of a faction and reinvent it as whatever we like, then we can do anything we want... including turning cyborg Jihadis from space into military zombie policemen, or whatever. If we can turn an Apple into an Orange based purely on whimsical personal taste, then why not turn that Orange into a Kiwi. The position you take has no ground to stand on since it's based on nothing more than your personal preference.
    2. I don't have special attachments to the Necris characters but I think it's really disconcerting how much we try to deviate from the conceptual core of these guys when there is absolutely no reason to, we can just introduce new factions if we don't think the old ones are appropriate. The only stance that makes any sense to me is to understand where the Necris come from conceptually and try to align the art direction with that. I'm still not seeing that in these new Necris designs but based on Chris' comments of them only being 40% complete I'm hoping we can see some more iteration along the lines of what guys like Mangley and hi-ban have proposed in this thread.
    1. Eh no, my position is exactly the one of a "fan who wants an internally consistent world that doesn't attempt to reinvent existing characters and factions into unrecognizable new versions every game," without denying UT3 events' very existence, when saying I'm against a total relaunch and yet another new type of (this time apparently zombie-necro-punk-soldier) Necris. I want exactly the next UT to bring consistency to all generations to unite the communities. What's really the problem if there are several different Necris? Why is my idea of the split types of Necris anyhow inconsistent? It's pretty much in-line with what I read on the Liandri Archives. Both UT99 and UT3 were official UTs and have fans, let's try to respect both.
    2. Since UT3's Necris that I very much liked are as much from Chris Perna's table as the new zombie soldier punk Necris I don't like, I don't think it's wrong to express him, as a fan of the first, my preference. For the mentioned reason not to reboot at 0 but rather unite and continue with even more consistency all previous UT designs that is aswell, not just for my personal taste only. I also posted to Mangley that I think he nailed the perfect sporty modern gladiator gear for me and that I only miss some Necris ornament seams for it to be perfect. I also wanted to throw in Gooba's concept, because it was never in discussion so far and I think he also gave an almost perfect evolved and consistent Necris concept there from a UT3 respecting person's view.


    Originally posted by Fartuess View Post
    1. You are starting to confuse me :P. Ok... very slowly... Neo is wearing black but he is not a goth. They are post 80s cyberpunk. Those pants are Goth Punk (and oldschool Necris had strong gothic vibe) but they are clearly not in Matrix style. The Gothic part is meant to differ them from classic 90's cyberpunk. But if you can't tell apart Gothpunk with Cyberpunk...
    2. Just like UT3 wiped everything from UT'99 and UT2k4. Feel our pain! ;>
    3. But honestly... UT3 is just neverending list of weird design choices and heresies aganist previous games. There's nothing strange in fact that UT'99 fans doesn't like that part. Gameplay wise UT3 was good, but designwise/storywise...
    4. I'm not impressed tbh. I see more potential in Reaper trying to get to Malcolm by participating in Tournament. Jester Necris might fall into one of two baskets. Either she will be pretty much same as before, what is not that interesting. Or she is other Necris with Jester backstory which doesn't make her impressive as a Necris.
    1. Those 2 different sentences were dealing with 2 different arguments. A) Neo is what I call "soft-goth" due to the trendy but black trenchcoat style. B)The pants are fully goth-punk and that's your wish for the BlackLegion Necris because UT99's looked kinda goth-like, totally understandable.
    2. That's no constructive argument to reunite the UT generations, obviously.
    3. I don't see it that way, I liked more than I missed or could criticize about it, but we surely also keep the good gameplay and go with designs all generations are happy with (or at least find smth they like of it). If you didn't like the cultist Necris or tentacle vehicles, cool, but don't deny it to others who liked it, just like I respect your wish for the goth-punk Necris which wouldn't meet my taste at all.
    4. Reaper must definitely join the tournament to get revenge at Malcolm, the second story cliffhanger, you're right. But would imo be even more awesome if a new Necris Jester comes (in the Gooba style i.e.) to the tournament, not part of the Ronin anymore but what she turned the cultist Necris into. Maybe "regeneration" instead of UT3's "supresssive expansion" is their new creed, so they die with nanoblack particle clouds additionally to some gore, tiny nanobots which later reassemble the char on respawn for those Necris faction (my fantasy going through already ). That all doesn't mean there are not your goth-punk Black Legion Necris aswell. #UT4all


    And now my opinion took really enough space of this thread for now and I leave the floor to more (hopefully all UTs consistently reuniting ) concepts and iterations. Probably every Epic Dev is going at reading (or skipping) such "hard-attached" fans opinions like ours.
    Last edited by TheoRiginal; 03-20-2015, 12:27 AM.

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      Originally posted by TheoRiginal View Post
      1. Eh no, my position is exactly the one of a "fan who wants an internally consistent world that doesn't attempt to reinvent existing characters and factions into unrecognizable new versions every game," without denying UT3 events' very existence, when saying I'm against a total relaunch and yet another new type of (this time apparently zombie-necro-punk-soldier) Necris. I want exactly the next UT to bring consistency to all generations to unite the communities. What's really the problem if there are several different Necris? Why is my idea of the split types of Necris anyhow inconsistent? It's pretty much in-line with what I read on the Liandri Archives. Both UT99 and UT3 were official UTs and have fans, let's try to respect both.
      2. Since UT3's Necris that I very much liked are as much from Chris Perna's table as the new zombie soldier punk Necris I don't like, I don't think it's wrong to express him, as a fan of the first, my preference. For the mentioned reason not to reboot at 0 but rather unite and continue with even more consistency all previous UT designs that is aswell, not just for my personal taste only. I also posted to Mangley that I think he nailed the perfect sporty modern gladiator gear for me and that I only miss some Necris ornament seams for it to be perfect. I also wanted to throw in Gooba's concept, because it was never in discussion so far and I think he also gave an almost perfect evolved and consistent Necris concept there from a UT3 respecting person's view.
      What it comes down to is that you like the Necris from UT3, which is fine, you're entitled to your opinion. The problematic thing is that you're trying to insist that we bridge the gap between UT3 Necris and Necris as a whole, despite the fact that these concepts are opposed to each other and explanations for bridging this gap are obviously hamfisted narrative patchwork. Deciding to accept subpar narrative just to tie together two elements that you happen to like degrades the quality of the entire game/universe. When it comes to bad narrative choices from past games it's much better to just ignore that they ever happened in any official sense.

      Just look at UT3, which was rightfully panned for introducing FLaGs to try and justify the incorporation of CTF into the War storyline. That's essentially what you're asking for, which is just piling bad narrative on top of bad narrative. No thanks.
      Last edited by Wail; 03-20-2015, 01:30 AM.
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        Nothing needs to be bridged, UT3's Necris are Necris "as a whole" already. I just offer you UT99 heads to bring them down to your tastes aswell. All you offer is UT3 being completely denied and ignored + exactly to "attempt to reinvent existing characters and factions into unrecognizable new versions every game." And I see it as most UT3 fans do, the war story was conflicting with the tournament idea and only a good solution to give some kind of campaign plot, but there's definitely no need for it in the new UT.

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          The Necris in UT3 are awful and they deviate too far from what Necris were in every previous game including UC2. I don't understand why this was done, and I certainly am not going to try to make that make sense.

          We can explain that away by saying that those Necris were part of a fringe group that split off and dabbled in cybernetics for some reason even though they were already effectually immortal. Maybe to enhance their abilities or something. Story sorted. Now let's ignore that that fringe group ever existed going forward and make the Necris that should exist because of the Necris in UT->UC2.

          In regards to why these alien races are joining the tournament, by the time UT storyline picks up the tournament is a galactic spectacle and teams from all over space are joining in. Personally I also like that story element added by UC2 that the Grand Tournament is like a sporting event before the Grand Championship every so many years that determines the galactic emperor or whatever. Lots of the specific cinematics in UC2 were pretty cheesy, but I did like the overall plot.
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            UT3 was Mists of Pandaria of Unreal universe


            Sorry. I could stop myself :P
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              Originally posted by Fartuess View Post
              Needs more buckles and PVC clothing, imo.

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                more dark goes not ?

                maybe more Steampunk, but in direction with Rubber hoses and electric accessors, "bork" like .. but not so heavy ..

                best regards
                blacky

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                    Frankly cyber goth is closer to what the Necris have always been than decked out cybernetic fatty.
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                      lol omg you guys, when did you stop updating your tastes? Must be somewhen in the ninety's or early twothousands, I guess. I'd even prefer "cybernetic fatty" to "cyber-goth." Hilarious clip, cafe!

                      My views on the new UT in a nutshell │ Social MarketplaceModern UT4 AllNew Dynamic StandardsMore iconic U and the 4 neededUE4 Free - I Epic

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                        Why not amorphous blob of nanoblack in the shape of a humanoid, then?

                        Heck, let's add spaghetti monsters and call them Necris while we're at it!
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                          Why not just sell different Necris back stories on the marketplace? If you're in the lead your version can be beamed into everyone else's minds

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                            I miss how the old Female Necris had a bit of a bondage/goth/vamp look to them, with the fishnet, I do miss those fishnnets. My favourite face was Malice, she had scars, red lipstick and very mean looking eyes with long dark hair to go with it. Dangerous, cold, calculating and beautiful are words I'd like to use. I feel the faces of the new female is way to plain as it is and needs some personality just like the male have gotten. Just dont make them too pretty so that I will feel like I am playing a Britney Spears character. This is a very common problem in most games now a days, the cool details like spikes, shoulderpads, boots, bags etc turn out too small on female chars, they don't look like they could hurt anyone. Where the male usually end up looking like a brutal killer. Please make them evenly scary. Perhaps the problem is that they always do the armour design alike instead of diffrant like UT99? To make the best of both genders. What look good on muscle dosent always look good on curves.

                            Necris and all the other factions in UT99 did have a more basic feel to them, ready to battle. Not too much tech, just enough. Here have this armour, and pick a gun, now fight your way to victory in the Liandri! it was all about the combat.
                            I really have been missing that, specially in the newer UTs when it mainly felt like clumsy "mechs" with hardly any differance to them on the playfield (seriously having hard time to see who's what faction). Necris were born to battle, and therefore did not care much for heavy and clumsy armour.

                            -Pale white skin
                            -Glowing white eyes
                            -Long hair
                            -Scars and personality

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                              Originally posted by Mangley View Post
                              Hi guys, thanks everybody for the great feedback!

                              I made various tweaks to those two designs, got rid of the number, declawed them and a few other things. I also went about mocking up female versions of these two armor sets:



                              Also I did a quick recolor for the team colors:




                              Thanks again for all the useful feedback. Please feel free to edit, paint-over, apply botox and such as you please.

                              This is really good, how ever I feel the Female version is inferior, with lacking hand gloves, not as cool shoulderpads or boots. She looks like a nice copy of the guy. Make her own that armour! Not just an ok alternative to playing male char, make her first choice. It dosen't have to be Exactly the same as his, but she does look tiny and timid in comparison.
                              Add some funky hairdo and maybe a scar She's way to pretty and plain.

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                                Originally posted by TheoRiginal View Post

                                Well then don't ask for punk. Perna's new zombie soldier Necris concept is clearly goth- (or necro-)punk, Hellions of UT2004 are clearly cyberpunk. I know some ppl call everything which is futuristic 'cyberpunk', but Matrix and Deus Ex aren't cyberpunk at all, they're just futuristic. I'm happy with that. I don't like real cyberpunk, which means really freaky wild style futuristic with neon colors, mohican haircuts and whatnot.
                                Wat.

                                Dude, no.

                                http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deus_Ex

                                "Deus Ex... is a cyberpunk-themed action-role playing video game—"

                                http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Matrix

                                "The film is an example of the cyberpunk science fiction genre.[6]"

                                Not to mention that The Matrix was heavily influenced by Ghost In the Shell...

                                Does UT take place in the future? Yes

                                Does UT have a distopian/grim setting? Yes

                                Does UT have amixture of high tech and low tech? Yes

                                Sorry, but UT (especially Unreal and UT99) is very much in the cyber-Punk genre.

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