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    #31
    Originally posted by Mangley View Post
    Chris these designs are really excellent and spot on for what I think of as a natural evolution of what the UT99 Necris Mercenary look would be today. I'm sad to see people arguing here and getting hung up on previous incarnations of what the Necris looked like instead of contributing.
    If I could contribute anything in this regard, it would be to remove nanoblack from the Necris lore, and make their exact origins a mystery.
    ...
    I'm not entirely sure how to draw that. (Actually, I just can't draw. But give me a rectangle and some photoshop effects and I can make a UI concept!)

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      #32
      This is superb! New Necris design looks best ever! Only thing i dislike are blue eyes, they should be white for sure.

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        #33
        Great Necris concept, and I don't see anything wrong with the nano-black idea. Only critique is.... less-mech, more-tech. I don't think mech parts will suit necris. Lots of cloth, wires, and subtle matte colored armor would work nicely.

        I put together some more sketches, other variations for the fem face and possible applications of the nano-tech.
        Facial morphing and reconstruction is another possible idea, but that's a long shot.

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          #34
          Things like blue glowing eyes, mechanical parts, wires or body reconstruction can be part of some necris designs, but it depends of state of owners body when he/she died. I assume that dead are transformed into necris by corporation, not alive transformed into necris by religious sect. In case of second there would be almost none external body damage.
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            #35
            Just keeping the tradition alive:

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              #36
              lol so you UT99 heads want of course exactly the opposite of what I suggested?
              Back to normal human vampire Ricky Martins instead of emotionless, higher beings?
              It's not gonna be my game such a remake UT, that's for sure.

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                #37
                Originally posted by TheoRiginal View Post
                lol so you UT99 heads want of course exactly the opposite of what I suggested?
                Back to normal human vampire Ricky Martins instead of emotionless, higher beings?
                It's not gonna be my game such a remake UT, that's for sure.
                Shocking revelation: People have different tastes.

                The point is not to reinvent factions that have a specific character as having a completely different character. No one is really objecting to having both Apples and Oranges. What we shouldn't be doing though is taking Oranges and referring to them as Apples.*
                The UT universe is big enough to have all kinds of factions. In my mind there is absolutely no reason to use a given faction in the game unless you're intent on keeping the stylization, flavor, and backstory of that faction. It's not even like the UT arsenal, which pretty much must include all of the standard weapons to be a Unreal Tournament game. But you can have an Unreal Tournament game without Lauren, without Malcolm, without Xan, without Loque, without any specific characters, without any of the well-known teams or factions. The Necris & Krall were reinvented in UT3 and it went over like a lead balloon. Even though I appreciated what that game did artistically, it trampled all over the lore in a way that made that game less enjoyable for long term fans of the series.

                * FWIW I don't think these concepts are that far off, but this is just an example for illustration.
                Last edited by Wail; 01-09-2015, 12:58 PM.
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                  #38
                  Originally posted by Wail View Post
                  Shocking revelation: People have different tastes.
                  Well, here are a few people with modern grafics taste and many people who want it to be looking just like in 1999. That's not an individual taste on neither side.

                  Originally posted by Wail View Post
                  The point is not to reinvent factions that have a specific character as having a completely different character.
                  Agree indeed, but fact is UT3 happened and did change the Necris radically. What you want now is to pretend it didn't happen and change them radically back, which is equally inconsistent with the UT lore (where UT3 is part of, whether you like it or not ).

                  Originally posted by Wail View Post
                  The UT universe is big enough to have all kinds of factions. In my mind there is absolutely no reason to use a given faction in the game unless you're intent on keeping the stylization, flavor, and backstory of that faction. It's not even like the UT arsenal, which pretty much must include all of the standard weapons to be a Unreal Tournament game. But you can have an Unreal Tournament game without Lauren, without Malcolm, without Xan, without Loque, without any specific characters, without any of the well-known teams or factions. The Necris & Krall were reinvented in UT3 and it went over like a lead balloon. Even though I appreciated what that game did artistically, it trampled all over the lore in a way that made that game less enjoyable for long term fans of the series.
                  I can totally agree with that, I just don't share your image of UT3's Necris design. But just pretending UT3 never happened is exactly the same form of radical changing and inconsistency, can you see this too?
                  Imo having this whole technology/architecture style for a faction like the Necris had, made a lot of UT3's superior immersion of an own Unreal Universe compared to the original UT (although surely not the same classic one you probably have in mind), so I'm pro unique and believable faction designs. Of course the individuality of each char must be kept aswell (didn't think that came too short in UT3: all Necris are very unique to one another).

                  But really, can't we come to a compromise, increasing consistency both towards UT99 and UT3?

                  Turning the bodies of the Necris more towards normal human vampire Ricky Martins with white pupils (for the UT99 trace) while elaborating their technology/architecture more starting from the UT3 design? Even if that turns into something totally different, I very much would like to see some form of consistency, some Necris evolution you can trace back in their design (one that doesn't exclude UT3 obviously ).

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                    #39
                    Originally posted by TheoRiginal View Post
                    Agree indeed, but fact is UT3 happened and did change the Necris radically. What you want now is to pretend it didn't happen and change them radically back, which is equally inconsistent with the UT lore (where UT3 is part of, whether you like it or not ).
                    I do not agree with you. It's not "equally inconsistent" to ignore something that was, according to most fans of the series, inconsistent with what was otherwise a reasonably consistent style. It is returning to consistency and removing a misstep in the Unreal universe lore. UT3's storyline as a whole was so bad that to me it is not even worth acknowledging -- Even if the game had fantastic elements to it in both gameplay and art, I have no desire to try and rationalize or justify the storyline blunders from that game.
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                      #40
                      UT3 lorewise never existed, just like Invisible War.
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                        #41
                        Originally posted by danpaz3d View Post
                        Great Necris concept, and I don't see anything wrong with the nano-black idea. Only critique is.... less-mech, more-tech. I don't think mech parts will suit necris. Lots of cloth, wires, and subtle matte colored armor would work nicely.

                        I put together some more sketches, other variations for the fem face and possible applications of the nano-tech.
                        Facial morphing and reconstruction is another possible idea, but that's a long shot.

                        4,5 and 8 ftw. I like the nanoblack fading like that
                        Last edited by Quadj130; 01-09-2015, 05:09 PM.

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                          #42
                          Originally posted by Laokin View Post
                          These are phenomenal updates to the Necris -- my only feedback is, a little too heavy on the mechanical parts. They do look more like Borg/Robots than they do "Re-Animated" people, it's a bit transhumanist, although -- I suppose reanimating the dead is transhumanist, they just look like they come from Deus Ex or Vampire The Masquerade: Bloodlines.

                          Tone back the metal a bit, make it very subtle and you've got winner designs.

                          You either have to go with Shiny Black as an additive or machines as an additive, but to do both steps us too far out of the previous molds for Necris that they don't really represent the franchise.

                          The Shiny black compliments the pale skin IMO, so I'd go with shiny black/minimal mechanical work, just to repair broken parts, no "Upgrades" like bionic legs or eyes or anything like that, that starts to lean on Liandri's robots too much.

                          Necris Phayder Tech shouldn't look like repurposed Liandri tech. The above concepts with the borg eyes and metal jaw replacements and stuff look too much like Robots and not enough like Re-Animated Undead. They are called the necris because it's "Future" necromancy, necro = dead tissue. Robots aren't tissue. Straying from the core concept of the Necris completely.
                          Dude this was great feedback! I agree they are too much like borg or cybernetic. I toned back the mechanical aspect a lot for the female designs:



                          Edit: Male also.

                          Attached Files
                          Last edited by Mangley; 01-10-2015, 06:59 PM.

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                            #43
                            Originally posted by Mangley View Post
                            Dude this was great feedback! I agree they are too much like borg or cybernetic. I toned back the mechanical aspect a lot for the female designs:



                            Going to go back over the male ones now.
                            Nice idea!
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                              #44
                              Originally posted by Wail View Post
                              It's not "equally inconsistent" to ignore something that was, according to most fans of the series, inconsistent with what was otherwise a reasonably consistent style. It is returning to consistency and removing a misstep in the Unreal universe lore. UT3's storyline as a whole was so bad that to me it is not even worth acknowledging -- Even if the game had fantastic elements to it in both gameplay and art, I have no desire to try and rationalize or justify the storyline blunders from that game.
                              The total denial of UT3 is a discrimination of UT3 fans I cant accept (hopefully Epic neither).
                              That's my problem with you UT99 hardliners, you dont even consider any compromise that might suit every UT generation's favor a bit.

                              If you're original enough, you can write every story back to a state you like it, you don't have to deny the existence of an official release. You owe it to the tiniest fan amount it might have, that it's at least not wiped out from history. I also have some troubles with the UT3 lore (for me turning Malcolm from the tournament champion into a traitor on the fellow Ronin was the worst) but that could all be explained, turned and fixed! Neglecting UT3 entirely and not transforming a better new UT out of it, is at least in matters of gameplay and art factually a capital mistake (besides the discrimination of UT3 fans).

                              A compromise could be totally in favor of your side but still giving UT3 the (very least) respect it deserves:
                              Additionally to...
                              Originally posted by Wail View Post
                              Design characteristics that I would like to see in the new Necris, personally:
                              - Pupil-less eyes (all-white)
                              - Generally longer hair, typically jet-black OR white
                              - Lack of obvious augmentation
                              - Ornate and ceremonial-seeming armor designs
                              ...go with:
                              - UT story is back to whatever the majority wants but its the UT3 timeline continued (just to acknowledge its existence)
                              - Necris changed back to vampire backstreetboys as much as the majority wants but their ornaments and technology are faintly reminiscent of UT3's oriental-organic design (to obtain consistent evolution of faction designs)

                              Such a small gesture would be enough. But who am I talking to? UT99 hardliners
                              Ok, I'll give it up and pass it to the real artists here, hopefully someone comes up with an evolution of Necris all can identify with.

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                                #45
                                Originally posted by TheoRiginal View Post
                                You owe it to the tiniest fan amount it might have...
                                No, not really. That's sort of like arguing that because some people enjoy the 6 pack rockets in UT99 that those must be brought back. It's just false to claim that we must do anything of the sort. If UT3 fans want to rationalize how to reconcile the storyline of that game with the Unreal universe I don't have a problem with them doing that, I don't see how that obligates anyone else to do that for them.

                                Originally posted by TheoRiginal View Post
                                You owe it to the tiniest fan amount it might have...
                                Such a small gesture would be enough. But who am I talking to? UT99 hardliners
                                It's really tedious to try and have a conversation with someone who refuses to actually acknowledge other people's perspectives and instead just wants to put words in their mouths and argue against strawmen.
                                Last edited by Wail; 01-10-2015, 02:07 AM.
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