Combine enforcer and hammer ?

[Smurgl]

It's a nice idea, especially as the secondary fire of the current enforcer and IH aren't great. However, switching to the IH does make you vulnerable whereas with an enforcer shot is a very viable weapon at the moment.

It would open another weapon slot to shake up the game (in addition to the bio slot which needs filling).

[exo7341]

Also pressure could be built from firing the regular firing mode of the enforcer (capture the energy of the detonation and recoil?)

I think it's pretty cool feature. Something like 'overpressure mode' - couple of regular shots charge your receiver and then you coud make one powerful hammer discharge (but less powerful than normal fully-charged mode). Gathered presure will not last forever though, let's say you have like 20 seconds to use it, otherwise its just releases to atmosphere via valve (making hiss like ASMD from Unreal I).

[Raste]

Neither the IH or Enforcer feel interesting anymore in their current iterations. Combining them sounds like something that would attract new fans and old alike for the ridiculous fun factor alone. This is what I've always said we should want ideally in a new UT game: The SPIRIT of UT, not a remake of old ideas which no longer resonate in the same way.

I don't really care if the concept of "Enforcer" is preserved, as long as the badassery is there. Call it the Hamfist for all I care. "That noob, with their Hamfisted tactics..."

I don't find the enforcer appealing right now, still feels like a placeholder weapon. The combination of the IH and Enforcer is indeed possibly leading to some badass moves / actions, and that's where we should keep our focus. I'll pm wail about this idea and see if having 4 weapon modes is possible.

I believe we should keep the two main firing modes, but then come up with something different for the alternate one(s). I know you are polyvalent in this field and if you have ideas on the firing modes, they are most welcome!

I like this idea. But technically, connect the pistol and hammer - idiocy. We need something larger, for example assault rifle.

It's all about this "Unreal" feel in the game. Why not have an enforcer with a canister on only one side (like the hammer in UT99), a simple motor to build up pressure and a couple pistons on it? Also pressure could be built from firing the regular firing mode of the enforcer (capture the energy of the detonation and recoil?)`. I believe going with a single bigger gun removes the badass and fun side of this idea...

I've seen a few complaints about the enforcer being too weak and in need of a replacement. By unifying the Impact Hammer and Enforcer using the HamForcer, then this complaint will start to dissipate.

Four firing states on a single weapon, this has got a lot of potential to raise the usability of this weapon.

Think about the potential combat scenarios with being able to have a shield and a pistol at the same time.

Personally, I would use the two button on the side of my mouse (Razer DeathAdder 2013) as the 3rd and 4th firing state buttons which would be the impact hammer firing states and leave mouse 1 and 2 for enforcer.

Again, if you have ideas or suggestions, please post them

Sounds very interesting. The Impact Hammer definitely needs gameplay refinement, that's one of the reasons why we haven't created a new model for it. We want to prototype different functionality which will inform the design. However, that's a ways off on our schedule so it would be awesome if you could team up with Wail (if he's interested) to make a working prototype.

Look forward to seeing progress on this, could be very cool!

With nice firing mode (4 in total on the same weapon), there are ways to turn it into a game changer that indeed could bring new players to this game. For me UT4 is lacking a little bit of badass elements like the ones in Bulletstorm for example. Something incredibly stupid and brutal, but badass and fun to use. The gauntlet in Q3 is a good example of it.

I'll pm wail and see what can be done, this could be a nice twist to the new UT4 that would solve the issue of the enforcer being weak and impact hammer requiring a lot of time to swap to.


EDIT: Wail has a full inbox ... please read this man haha, I'll check on IRC too

[Skaary]

The best solution for this weapon - primary fire of Impact Hammer and alternate fire of Dispersion Pistol from the first Unreal. Also, on the map can scatter (as in the first Unreal) upgrades for Dispersion Pistol.

It will add depth to the gameplay, will make it more diverse + players will be often use the Impact Hammer: they will have an incentive to do so.

[InVader]

Imho, if I look at some of the prototype weapons, even tertiary fire modes are over-complicating some guns a lot. 4 fire modes would be waaaay too much. I'd simply just replace the tri-shot alt-fire on the enforcer (which is equally redundant) with the hammer primary or some other melee ability.

Also I'd like to keep the 'pistol' aspect of your starting weapon if possible. There's just that simple obscure something about them. There's nothing quite like the feeling of wielding akimbo enforcers - just like the feeling of dual berettas, ever since Max Payne made it look cool. I can't quite describe why I love akimbo pistols. I simply do, I guess.

Anyone else shares this love for pistols?

EDIT: As for the dual-hammer forcers, I think it could amplify the melee ability. A single hammer-forcer could have a simple aim-click melee ability, instead of charging a hammer, BUT it would do non-lethal damage with full boost height. Wield 2 of them would amplify the melee ability to full (lethal) damage (still no need to charge).

[richardboegli]

I've seen a few complaints about the enforcer being too weak and in need of a replacement. By unifying the Impact Hammer and Enforcer using the HamForcer, then this complaint will start to dissipate.

Four firing states on a single weapon, this has got a lot of potential to raise the usability of this weapon.

Think about the potential combat scenarios with being able to have a shield and a pistol at the same time.

Personally, I would use the two button on the side of my mouse (Razer DeathAdder 2013) as the 3rd and 4th firing state buttons which would be the impact hammer firing states and leave mouse 1 and 2 for enforcer.

 

Spoiler

[richardboegli]

So when going akimbo you'd be able to Impact Jump twice as high.....this would be VERY interesting.

[HenrikRyosa]

Neither the IH or Enforcer feel interesting anymore in their current iterations. Combining them sounds like something that would attract new fans and old alike for the ridiculous fun factor alone. This is what I've always said we should want ideally in a new UT game: The SPIRIT of UT, not a remake of old ideas which no longer resonate in the same way.

I don't really care if the concept of "Enforcer" is preserved, as long as the badassery is there. Call it the Hamfist for all I care. "That noob, with their Hamfisted tactics..."

[InVader]

How about a hidden gun? This is what it would look normally when you equip the pistol, but on alt-fire you'd hide the pistol temporarily and start charging the hammer instead, which would sort of encompass your entire lower hand. Or at least the outer half of it.

[Mad IVIax]

I like this idea. But technically, connect the pistol and hammer - idiocy. We need something larger, for example assault rifle.


So, my ugly suggestion:
(Oh, I'd like to be able to draw ((()
Enforcer from UT 3 and Shield Gun from UT 2004.

[InVader]

Autodesk Inventor

Somebody sure is rich :P

[YemYam]

Sounds very interesting. The Impact Hammer definitely needs gameplay refinement, that's one of the reasons why we haven't created a new model for it. We want to prototype different functionality which will inform the design. However, that's a ways off on our schedule so it would be awesome if you could team up with Wail (if he's interested) to make a working prototype.

Look forward to seeing progress on this, could be very cool!

[richardboegli]

but we would have to find a guy who is brave enough to go full Transformers with both the model and the animations for it

Just have to use the right tool for the job

I do all my modelling using a proper engineering modelling tool, Autodesk Inventor, which is designed for 3d mechanical modelling.

Doing moving bits is cake walk, compared to doing it in something like 3DS Max.

I'm trying to refine my workflow to be able to easily get assembled / animated things from Inventor to UE4 / UT4.

I'm not putting my hand up yet, but I'll be watching with a keen eye

[InVader]

It's a challenge to keep the signature look of an enforcer while adding the hammer to it. It will need more work, I'll come up with a couple ideas for the design this week-end hopefully

Exactly. It will definitively need a new-ish model. A transforming gun is the easiest solution for this, but we would have to find a guy who is brave enough to go full Transformers with both the model and the animations for it Just imagining it scares me from the work (I now view the guys who worked on the movies as gods).

Imho the wrist attachment idea suits the Translocator much better (wasn't the UT99 transloc a wrist attachment?). It would also suggest that you'd be able to use it either as melee or for hammerjumping at any time - now that is an idea I don't resent, because it would embrace hammerjumping, but it would be a HUGE change.

[NATO_chrisjm]

Ha! Neat idea