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    Community Mapping Team

    Would anyone be interested in starting up a community mapping team?

    That way level designers, 3D artists, concept artists, people who can make great textures/materials, modders, musicians and game testers could all work together in creating some amazing maps.

    There are level designers out there (like myself) who don't yet know how to do 3D design, and 3D designers who don't know how to map... And so on.
    It would give everyone a chance to contribute something and also be fun.

    There are a ton of really nice map shells out there that need the visuals done. We could make a map pack out of the best and most playable maps.


    Maps could be split into categories.

    DM

    Competitive Duel maps
    Competitive free for all maps used for team games and so on
    Fun arena maps, for sniper players, low gravity players, insta players.

    CTF


    Competitive
    Fun maps
    w00t maps.

    Visually stunning maps.


    And when other mods take hold we could map for them also.

    Everyone will get assigned to a certain map and team (will have to work out a way to do that)

    I think it will be a great way for the mapping community to thrive and also give Epic some new maps to add to the HUBS and maybe even the finished game itself if they are good enough.

    Thought and suggestions?
    Win 10
    iMac (27-inch, Late 2013)
    3.5 GHz Intel Core i7
    32 GB 1600 MHz DDR3
    NVIDIA GeForce GTX 780M 4096 MB

    Maps:
    DM-RadioActive (Work In progress) DM-Ethos (WIP) DM-QWERTY (WIP) DM-TwinFalls(WIP)
    2k4 DM-MoonGames, DM-Abrenabba, DM-Aphelion, DM-Pyrimid-Of-Gold, DM-UPH-Hexed, Dm-Saint, DM-LethalAdixion, DM-C4-Ariza, Dm-C4-SleepyTomb,

    #2
    I think it's a great idea but is plagued by it's design.

    In dayz gone by, map teams would grow organically from the community; typically by mutual respect of existing design(s). As it stands now, there are plenty of good mappers out there and I believe that a thing such as this is going to happen without any intervention or 'push'. The other thing is that the community is tiny compared to CS, ironically they got the best map already 'De_Dust2' - which I hear they teach at college! No one wants to innovate in CS.

    My thoughts on what they will design...I think it would be safe to say most teams will revert to 'classical' design or go into competitive map design - instead of focusing on thematic or visually arresting designs. Epic do provide a lot of mesh work for the community and I believe no one will stray too far away from this. The Outpost23 pack is really, really good - the colours are modifiable and the meshes render really quickly. This combination does give groundwork for map construction and individuality to make it their own. Outpost23 assets, in a way, have become De_Dust2 - but not the map, so you have lots of people making their own map design using these assets.

    Perhaps I'm wrong. Perhaps the community needs someone to stand tall and sound the horn on this. If so, your approach gets my support. If not, I think a really good thing for us to do would be to do some social networking and get more people playing this game, because it's not getting a lot of <3 right now with the numbers.

    More players equates to a bigger community and more feedback. I garuntee you there is someone out there who has the best map in their head, but has never used UT. We need to hire the A team so they can be found, which is pretty hard when the game is not even released and Epic have got the B team working on UT. No Face, no Murdoch no BA and I've never seen any of the Epic guys smoking a cigar, so no Hannibal, either.

    We also need a better editor for map design to pull in more people - there is too much emphasis on the community to 'figure it out' when it comes to something simple, like destructible environments or...oh I don't know, exploding barrels? I've posted this before but there is too much about the process of building a map which just turns people off within seconds.

    The brush system is horrible, that breaks once you go above 500 surfaces. There are sooooo many issues with this system. Like I recall the other day when I couldn't flip something and deleted a vertex and tried to repopulate in a different direction. Couldn't figure out why I was getting an error and had to go through documentation to learn the BSP has to be welded clockwise, and if you don't it will crash! They tell you not to use a lot brushes, and to minimise surfaces wherever possible - but offer nothing that assists you in doing this. If you have a subtractive design, rooms all have to use equal grid proportions. so, if you have one room which was built using a 10-point and the adjacent room is on a 50-point grid, and the connection corridor is a 5 point system: then you got problems. These problems are many, varied and utterly frustrating when they appear. Lighting issues, holes, blocking/collisions.

    The engine is too dependant on external third party tools.

    This is a problem, because Hammer and Radiant are better mapping tools for FPS and use brushes. Epic had the option of reworking their BSP system, but fell back on the idea that people will shell a map, and then pass to 'the art department' to do the mesh work and environment build. For us, this is not at all helpful because it is just one person using one tool trying to make everything work, when the engine just smacks you in the face at every turn. It presupposes you have a team of experts in the next cubicle to solve everything. It also believes that using a farm-render system is perfectly acceptable as everyone must be using a farm render to crunch everything through CPU lighting builds? Surely they have an underground Batcave with a fleet of CPU cores at the ready to crunch lighting passes in one fell swoop? Don't they? I mean, they can't be using just one computer to build lights can they? Surely not.

    CUDA/OPENCL would solve this. Push all of the baking to the GPU. You'll note the actual map builds in seconds, but the baking takes an eternity. Not a problem if you got NASA-esqe levels of CPU power to draw on, but for us mere mortals; it's a joke.

    I work with it as best I can, but unless the base tools for map building are improved or (better) replaced with something which works, mappers are not going to be drawn to this engine - that's on top of a small community and low player count.

    UT will remain what it is: an idealistic personal project and hobby for the winter months.

    It has issues and needs about $100 million in marketing, (much) better tools and another 50 members of staff before it reaches peak interest of gamers.
    Maps:

    DM-PSi ; DM-Genku ; DM-Untold Storage ; DM-Station (WIP) ; DM-HeatRay Physx (WIP)

    DM/TSD-Formidable (WIP)

    Comment


      #3
      Originally posted by effects69 View Post
      people who can make great textures/materials
      We could really use some free texture/materials packs for UT4. There really aren't any other than perhaps the Nobiax textures (UT3 material) and Hourences old texture packs from years ago. I've had to scrounge around the 'Net to find free materials and textures that I could turn into materials for my maps.

      Perhaps a "Textures" or "Materials" forum could be created as a sub-forum in UT Art.
      UT4 CTF Maps: CTF-Whiplash | CTF-Sidewinder | CTF-Highpoint | CTF-Hardcore | CTF-Tubes-Of-Spam

      UT99 CTF Maps: CTF-DagnysBigAssMap-V2 | CTF-Dagnys-P****WhIpPeD | CTF-Dagnys-Dark-Delight-LE102 | CTF-Dagnys-Tubes-Of-Spam

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by WHIPperSNAPper View Post
        We could really use some free texture/materials packs for UT4. There really aren't any other than perhaps the Nobiax textures (UT3 material) and Hourences old texture packs from years ago. I've had to scrounge around the 'Net to find free materials and textures that I could turn into materials for my maps.

        Perhaps a "Textures" or "Materials" forum could be created as a sub-forum in UT Art.
        Personally I'd like to see more meshes. Lamps, Lighting fixtures, Doors and Windows (all with materials applied) would be terrific for starters. Cover a few different themes, ancient, modern industrial and sci-fi.

        For textures/materials and meshes too, the engine demos have quite a bit of useful stuff. I'm really looking forward to the game editor going to 4.9 or higher so I can try using some of the assets in the Infiltrator demo.

        A sub-forum would be great too though I think just calling it "Assets" and putting it in the level design forums would be better.
        Last edited by MoxNix; 12-04-2015, 08:50 AM.

        Comment


          #5
          That's a good idea, MoxNix, i agree Would be cool to see people post these things being importable in the unreal editor etc. If i understand correctly (I have no clue about the unreal editor) there are problems with importing meshes from the unreal engine marketplace etc.? In my opinion this is a major bummer, thinking about the potential of all those asset sets that are already available on the unreal engine marketplace.

          Comment


            #6
            The only problems with importing UE assets into UT are:

            1. You have to have both the UE editor and the UT editor installed to do it.

            2. You have to have at least the same engine version in UT as they were created with in UE. In other words, you can't import (or migrate) UE 4.9 assets into UT 4.8, or at least not without a whole lot of work involving other programs.

            Besides that it's pretty simple, just select the project's root content folder in UE4, choose "migrate" and migrate everything in the project to your UT4 Editor root Content folder. Then fire up the UT Editor and it'll automatically discover the assets.

            Or someone who has the UE4 editor installed can zip assets up for others to use in UT4 without installing the UE4 Editor. I did that with the Sun Temple demo.

            https://forums.unrealtournament.com/...ght=sun+temple

            I'd do it for more demos except they're large files that take forever to upload on my 1Mbs upload connection.
            Last edited by MoxNix; 12-04-2015, 10:25 AM.

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by MoxNix View Post
              The only problems with importing UE assets into UT are:

              1. You have to have both the UE editor and the UT editor installed to do it.

              2. You have to have at least the same engine version in UT as they were created with in UE. In other words, you can't import (or migrate) UE 4.9 assets into UT 4.8, or at least not without a whole lot of work involving other programs.

              Besides that it's pretty simple, just select the project's root content folder in UE4, choose "migrate" and migrate everything in the project to your UT4 Editor root Content folder. Then fire up the UT Editor and it'll automatically discover the assets.

              Or someone who has the UE4 editor installed can zip assets up for others to use in UT4 without installing the UE4 Editor. I did that with the Sun Temple demo.

              https://forums.unrealtournament.com/...ght=sun+temple

              I'd do it for more demos except they're large files that take forever to upload on my 1Mbs upload connection.
              You dont need the UE editor to import UE assets into the UT Editor.
              PayBack

              Comment


                #8
                More assets would of course be great! And I'm sure we will get them as time goes on and more Epic maps are meshed out, but it would also be great to have a bunch of community made assets too, and original assets made for specific maps, otherwise everything will start looking the same, we will have a ton of Outpost and Titan Pass looking maps

                I've noticed a few threads started with the means to share original meshes, but nothing has really come of them.

                As for importing assets from the other editor, I'm gonna give that a try again after the next build and see if it works, although I've had no luck in the past. But I'm gonna have to wait until the new year as this laptop I'm on can't handle lots of detail + I can't really tell what anything looks like on the low settings.

                I still think a map pack would be great, one that caters to all types of players.
                Win 10
                iMac (27-inch, Late 2013)
                3.5 GHz Intel Core i7
                32 GB 1600 MHz DDR3
                NVIDIA GeForce GTX 780M 4096 MB

                Maps:
                DM-RadioActive (Work In progress) DM-Ethos (WIP) DM-QWERTY (WIP) DM-TwinFalls(WIP)
                2k4 DM-MoonGames, DM-Abrenabba, DM-Aphelion, DM-Pyrimid-Of-Gold, DM-UPH-Hexed, Dm-Saint, DM-LethalAdixion, DM-C4-Ariza, Dm-C4-SleepyTomb,

                Comment


                  #9
                  Originally posted by effects69 View Post
                  More assets would of course be great! And I'm sure we will get them as time goes on and more Epic maps are meshed out, but it would also be great to have a bunch of community made assets too, and original assets made for specific maps, otherwise everything will start looking the same, we will have a ton of Outpost and Titan Pass looking maps

                  I've noticed a few threads started with the means to share original meshes, but nothing has really come of them.

                  As for importing assets from the other editor, I'm gonna give that a try again after the next build and see if it works, although I've had no luck in the past. But I'm gonna have to wait until the new year as this laptop I'm on can't handle lots of detail + I can't really tell what anything looks like on the low settings.

                  I still think a map pack would be great, one that caters to all types of players.
                  Yes, but due to the material instancing of the assets and design of the game, you can create completely independent and unique maps. Something as simple as the colour schemes can dramatically alter the look of a map, particularly with the Outpost23 assets.

                  The materials also work extraordinarily well with UT3 meshes from a particular mesh set, almost as if they used these meshes with new materials prior to meshes for Outpost23 being complete. Combined with the material instancing and new colours you can obtain your individual style and apply it. Then there are the environmental factors and detailing involved, like foliage and trims. These are pretty uniform in size and grid spacing, and once again can be used to bling out your level/map. In addition to this, very very very very simple mesh work can be fine, as once materials are added look perfect.

                  Also, bare in mind that most will turn everything down to low GFX settings and so ultimately, none of this really matters anyway. The map design is everything, and it is this which should be polished to a mirror shine before any considerations of meshing need to be applied.

                  Personally, I drag n drop three meshes on a wall, change the colours to the three primaries and move on. Then I can come back to it later and make a choice.

                  I like colour.
                   
                  Spoiler
                  Attached Files
                  Maps:

                  DM-PSi ; DM-Genku ; DM-Untold Storage ; DM-Station (WIP) ; DM-HeatRay Physx (WIP)

                  DM/TSD-Formidable (WIP)

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Yup, I like colour too

                    Attached Files
                    Win 10
                    iMac (27-inch, Late 2013)
                    3.5 GHz Intel Core i7
                    32 GB 1600 MHz DDR3
                    NVIDIA GeForce GTX 780M 4096 MB

                    Maps:
                    DM-RadioActive (Work In progress) DM-Ethos (WIP) DM-QWERTY (WIP) DM-TwinFalls(WIP)
                    2k4 DM-MoonGames, DM-Abrenabba, DM-Aphelion, DM-Pyrimid-Of-Gold, DM-UPH-Hexed, Dm-Saint, DM-LethalAdixion, DM-C4-Ariza, Dm-C4-SleepyTomb,

                    Comment


                      #11
                      I'll be around, helping out with the creation of custom content.
                      Last edited by 3Dmatic; 12-06-2015, 11:25 AM.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        you guys have any recommendation for free texture packs? links?
                        I am mostly active in iCTF maps and made a few alrdy being played a lot in our pickupgames
                        Visit our website unreal-battles.net
                        Join the
                        European UT4 community on Facebook @ www.ut4.eu/fb-group-page/ and webchat + games @ click here


                        Comment


                          #13
                          On Steam, I got my hands on Substance Designer 5/ Substance Painter. The Unreal community could easily come up with a massive library of PBR textures and that could help us to maintain a certain consistency between assets and maps.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            It would be really nice if we could get a lot more concept artists and 3D artists on board.

                            Comment


                              #15
                              Originally posted by effects69 View Post
                              Yup, I like colour too


                              I hate color.
                              Attached Files

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