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    [PROTOTYPE] DM-Sewage

    Hey guys, after an issue re-installing the editor which caused me to lose of my map files I decided to try my hand at making a duel map. So here's DM-Sewage, as an early block-out, haven't textured it yet. Feedback is heartily appreciated!





    Pak: http://www.mediafire.com/download/5y...wsNoEditor.zip

    UPDATE Alpha-02:

    Prettied everything up, replaced Keg with leg pads, and leg pads with shield belt. Moved around ammo placement, and added blocking volumes to make it more difficult to get out of the map. I still don't really like the thigh pad area, may re-do that bit.

    UPDATE Alpha-03:
    Changed around the thigh-pad area and the shield belt area. I think they work a bit better now. Also prettied everything up to a point where I'm happy with it. Next step will be materials, if all goes well, and you guys are happy with the layout.

    UPDATE Alpha-04:
    Added some better lighting, changed the armor vest spawn layout to make it a bit more contestable, and changed the udamage spawn a bit. Also removed the stupid post-process volume in the water that I'd forgotten about.

    UPDATE Alpha-05:
    Mostly visual stuff this time, mainly adding materials. Also converted most grates to static meshes so that I could give them better collision (you can no longer shoot the bars while trying to shoot through them).

    UPDATE Alpha-06:
    Minor changes, swapped the belt and the chest, and replaced the thigh pads with a helmet. Also made the udamage a bit harder to get to. Made the jump pad from the lift to the sniper a little faster, as well as the lift near the rocket launcher.

    UPDATE Alpha-08:
    Re-textured everything again so that it should once again look somewhat like the images above.

    UPDATE Alpha-09: Swapped the two helmets and the belt & vest, so belt is above Udamage now, and armor is by rocket, while the helmets are by the flak and in the sewer. Also added another dodge ramp up to the rocket launcher level, and added more lights/improved the lighting.
    Attached Files
    Last edited by Darksteel; 05-31-2015, 01:48 PM.
    My maps: DM-Incomplete | DM-Archives | DM-Foundry | DM-Sewage

    #2
    Originally posted by Darksteel View Post
    Hey guys, after an issue re-installing the editor which caused me to lose of my map files I decided to try my hand at making a duel map.
    Sorry to hear that I'm always paranoid my files will be overwritten in an update or something. Map looks interesting from the photos, I'll give it a run through as soon as I can.
    DM-Nine | CTF-HolyOak

    Comment


      #3
      I did a teensy update after I posted, so it looks a bit different than in the pics, but it should play about the same.
      My maps: DM-Incomplete | DM-Archives | DM-Foundry | DM-Sewage

      Comment


        #4
        UPDATE:

        Updated pics, pak file, and update notes.
        My maps: DM-Incomplete | DM-Archives | DM-Foundry | DM-Sewage

        Comment


          #5
          EDIT: Realised that you updated some positions of items but not in this pak. Sorry!

          Just some quick thoughts:

          - Throw some materialon, hard to see stuff! Try just using Blank_Concrete I think its called for now.. Also some corners of the the map were dark, maybe turn the indirect lighting of the Directional Light for the map up a bit.

          - A lot of detailed BSP for a shell, means you get stuck in some annoying places (bridges in the centre of the map/things that look like you can travel up/to but can't). Don't get me wrong, your bsp work makes the map look cool(good job) but its unnecessary and just makes it harder to both assess the map and also harder for you if you need to change stuff.

          - I agree on the thighpads area, not a lot of reason to go there, perhaps placing the shock/better weapons there would help. Probably would remove the pads and place the UDamage there instead or move the shield there, currently underneath the water you lose ~10 seconds of it and are super vulnerable to being shot anyway, isn't worth the risk.

          - Slide dodge by the helmet. Why do I have to dodge up a slope (slow/vulnerable) to have to still walk over the to the helmet? Y ou could put the slope leading directly to the helmet instead.

          - Also know you have the blocking volumes in but a lot of the jumps from lifts you smash your head on things(thighpads lift jump) and it feels really awkward.

          Great job on this though, good potential! I like the map quite a bit, it just needs refining and more refining until it feels really sweet to play.
          Last edited by Yndi; 05-22-2015, 05:54 AM.

          Comment


            #6
            I had a run round the map and I like the theme a lot

            If I had one slight gameplay complaint at this early stage it would be the flak/belt area. It seems a little cramped, especially considering you can lift jump around there. I would suggest turning the slope dodge into a larger walk ramp, moving the flak to a more central location in the room and removing the 100x100 pillar whilst also widening the door slightly. Good work so far
            :|

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by Yndi View Post
              - Slide dodge by the helmet. Why do I have to dodge up a slope (slow/vulnerable) to have to still walk over the to the helmet? Y ou could put the slope leading directly to the helmet instead.
              You can wall slide right to the helmet, no further walking required!
              My maps: DM-Incomplete | DM-Archives | DM-Foundry | DM-Sewage

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by Yndi View Post
                (bridges in the centre of the map/things that look like you can travel up/to but can't).
                Can you explain what you mean by that? I'm not sure I know where that is... Though it may be because I have a slightly newer version of the map, and may not have that.

                Originally posted by Yndi View Post
                - Also know you have the blocking volumes in but a lot of the jumps from lifts you smash your head on things(thighpads lift jump) and it feels really awkward.
                That isn't a blocking volume, and will likely get replaced when I redo the area.
                My maps: DM-Incomplete | DM-Archives | DM-Foundry | DM-Sewage

                Comment


                  #9
                  UPDATE:

                  Updated pics, pak file, and change notes.
                  My maps: DM-Incomplete | DM-Archives | DM-Foundry | DM-Sewage

                  Comment


                    #10
                    So I was just gonna release a quick fix that fixed a blocking volume and the silly post-process volume I'd forgotten about, but I ended up doing a bunch of work. So here you go, new update, enjoy!
                    My maps: DM-Incomplete | DM-Archives | DM-Foundry | DM-Sewage

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                      #11
                      UPDATE: Updated the pics, paks and update notes.
                      My maps: DM-Incomplete | DM-Archives | DM-Foundry | DM-Sewage

                      Comment


                        #12
                        HA, you thought you got away from my critique when you lost your files? Not likely buddy! In lieu of no longer being able to test DM-Foundry, I'm going to take a crack at this one instead!

                        Alright, right away just on the first run-through, I like it a ton more than the first pass of Foundry. I might even like it more than the last update. It's much more fluid, movement from one area to another is always easy and intuitive, most areas have lots of entrances and exits, plenty of Z, and interesting geometry to play with. Particularly of note too is that the environment feels very nicely scaled for UT4; a lot of the current maps tend to feel like the rooms are too wide to me, and yours feels tight and satisfying. There's also a nice mix of open and enclosed areas that cater to different weapon choices nicely.

                        The lift jump to the vials from the water area feels really finnicky. Even with no one shooting at me, I had to attempt it six times before I managed it; the shape of the hole compared to the elevator means that I would hit my head on pretty much every jump even when it felt like I was clear.

                        I like the shield belt area, but I feel like it's less dangerous than the amp and 100a areas. It's also right next to the shock rifle which will make that area of the map highly desirable to own; it might play better if you swap the 100a and shield belt.

                        Every time I'm near the shock, I see the dodge ramp up to the vials and wish there were a way to use it. A small ledge below the ramp might be worth looking into to let the player get from shock to that area. If it's possible to walldodge onto the ramp and get up there, I never made it, I was always a bit short.

                        I'd like to see the jump pads give a little less height and a little more speed. Most of the map is very quick to traverse and the jump pads feel slow and unsatisfying in comparison.

                        It is possible to get up on top of the map, but I actually think there are a few areas that would benefit from allowing the player to be there. Specifically, the narrow ledge above the shock vials and above the elevator jump area both have some interesting geometry; when you seal off the map, it might be worth considering leaving a couple vials or a sniper ammo box up there and accessible from a hammer jump.

                        I always found myself wishing there was a way up to the rocket launcher level from the area directly below that 45 degree cutoff just below it, maybe a slope dodge. I can see the argument for not wanting to cut off the area behind it, just something that my brain always thought in that area, that it would be nice to have a route up instead of having to go the long way around. I know it made me grab the rockets less often.

                        The rotating sludge paddles (I know there's a name for it, but you know what I mean) near the amp are really really cool and I like the idea a lot. The bots don't like them so much though, they had problems with drowning there a couple times. Still, it's a good enough idea I would say leave it like it is and wait for Epic to code the bots to be less stupid with moving objects and with water I guess.

                        The fact that there are so many powerups can make it a bit tough to establish map control (I played a 3 player FFA and a 4 player, plus a round alone) but if you can get it, the fact that there's 320 points of armor plus an amp on such a small map can lead to a pretty easy win. Just something to keep in mind; with this density of powerups the placement will make or break the map. The first game I didn't get control and actually didn't win to my surprise; the second game I did and went on a 20 kill streak.

                        I'd say you're really on to something with this map; for ten straight minutes I had so much fun that I didn't alt tab to jot down feedback, which is, ironically, a good sign. I look forward to seeing what you come up with!

                        Oh, and I don't know exactly what sort of sewer you're going to go with, but I really enjoyed listening to Nether Animal from the original UT while playing, it just seemed to fit. :] The pools of light and shadow plus the damp-seeming atmosphere work with it for me.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by aniviron View Post
                          The lift jump to the vials from the water area feels really finnicky. Even with no one shooting at me, I had to attempt it six times before I managed it; the shape of the hole compared to the elevator means that I would hit my head on pretty much every jump even when it felt like I was clear.
                          For some reason I have an issue with my save, where approximately half of my BSP brushes are off by either 1 or 4 units, no idea why. So whenever I try and build geometry it messes everything up... So, I'm going to refrain from fiddling with the geometry for now, but I have made that lift a little faster so it should be a bit easier to land the jump.

                          Originally posted by aniviron View Post
                          I like the shield belt area, but I feel like it's less dangerous than the amp and 100a areas. It's also right next to the shock rifle which will make that area of the map highly desirable to own; it might play better if you swap the 100a and shield belt.
                          I've swapped the two in my latest version as a test, if it turns out well, I'll keep it that way. I like the water as a sound cure for the shield belt.

                          Originally posted by aniviron View Post
                          Every time I'm near the shock, I see the dodge ramp up to the vials and wish there were a way to use it. A small ledge below the ramp might be worth looking into to let the player get from shock to that area. If it's possible to walldodge onto the ramp and get up there, I never made it, I was always a bit short.
                          You can slope dodge from the other side, and wall dodge from the pipes above the shield belt (now armor vest). From the shock spawn you can either shard or rocket jump, and you may be able to hammer jump. Not sure about that yet.

                          Originally posted by aniviron View Post
                          I'd like to see the jump pads give a little less height and a little more speed. Most of the map is very quick to traverse and the jump pads feel slow and unsatisfying in comparison.
                          Done for the one from the stinger lift to the sniper spawn, but I left the other as is, because it makes it a bit easier to do some maneuvers with it, if it is slower.

                          Originally posted by aniviron View Post
                          It is possible to get up on top of the map, but I actually think there are a few areas that would benefit from allowing the player to be there. Specifically, the narrow ledge above the shock vials and above the elevator jump area both have some interesting geometry; when you seal off the map, it might be worth considering leaving a couple vials or a sniper ammo box up there and accessible from a hammer jump.
                          Originally posted by aniviron View Post
                          I always found myself wishing there was a way up to the rocket launcher level from the area directly below that 45 degree cutoff just below it, maybe a slope dodge. I can see the argument for not wanting to cut off the area behind it, just something that my brain always thought in that area, that it would be nice to have a route up instead of having to go the long way around. I know it made me grab the rockets less often.
                          You can do a bit of a wall dodge to get up to the higher level, rather than going around, other than that, not currently going to change the geometry for reasons stated above. :/

                          Originally posted by aniviron View Post
                          The rotating sludge paddles (I know there's a name for it, but you know what I mean) near the amp are really really cool and I like the idea a lot. The bots don't like them so much though, they had problems with drowning there a couple times. Still, it's a good enough idea I would say leave it like it is and wait for Epic to code the bots to be less stupid with moving objects and with water I guess.
                          Originally posted by aniviron View Post
                          The fact that there are so many powerups can make it a bit tough to establish map control (I played a 3 player FFA and a 4 player, plus a round alone) but if you can get it, the fact that there's 320 points of armor plus an amp on such a small map can lead to a pretty easy win. Just something to keep in mind; with this density of powerups the placement will make or break the map. The first game I didn't get control and actually didn't win to my surprise; the second game I did and went on a 20 kill streak.
                          Replaced the thighpads with another helmet so that there is less armor availible, and made it a little harder to get to the Udamage by raising and slowing down the "sludge paddles" so that they get in your way a bit more.

                          Originally posted by aniviron View Post
                          I'd say you're really on to something with this map; for ten straight minutes I had so much fun that I didn't alt tab to jot down feedback, which is, ironically, a good sign. I look forward to seeing what you come up with!

                          Oh, and I don't know exactly what sort of sewer you're going to go with, but I really enjoyed listening to Nether Animal from the original UT while playing, it just seemed to fit. :] The pools of light and shadow plus the damp-seeming atmosphere work with it for me.
                          Thanks for the feedback, glad you liked it! I'll probably not put music on it for now, but we'll see how it goes!
                          My maps: DM-Incomplete | DM-Archives | DM-Foundry | DM-Sewage

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                            #14
                            Updated the PAK file and update notes with the build mentioned in my previous post. (see directly above)
                            My maps: DM-Incomplete | DM-Archives | DM-Foundry | DM-Sewage

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                              #15
                              Just realized I exported and uploaded the wrong map. Fixing it now.

                              EDIT: Fixed.
                              Last edited by Darksteel; 05-28-2015, 12:57 AM.
                              My maps: DM-Incomplete | DM-Archives | DM-Foundry | DM-Sewage

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