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  • Weapon Respawn Time in TDM

    Disclaimer: changing the weapon Respawn time would be for testing purposes only.

    I'm a realist. I want to cater to EVERYONE in this game, so we don't have to pump out competitive mods such as UTCOMP to make the hardcover players happy.

    Anyhow, my purposal is a pretty simple one for TDM. Weaponstay should be OFF for gametypes such as duel and TDM, which are both recognized as competitive/hardcore gametypes in the Unreal community. Thirty seconds seems like a good respawn time for duel, considering it's only two players battling it out on a map. However, reminiscing on past matches in 2k4/UT3 throughout the years, I believe 27/30 seconds was a bit overkill for TDM, especially in the 4v4 preset.

    My proposal would be for 20 seconds, which is 10 seconds less than the normal respawn time. The reasoning I am composing this thread is because casual/new players simply cannot run around the map too long without a weapon. This causes a lot of players to quit. 20 seconds still allows for map control, but is short enough to still have some weapons available for 8 players all of the time in the map.

    I want to see TDM succeed. It's always been a fairly hard gametype for new players to get into. One of the first defense responses someone will post is "Matchmaking will fix this skill gap problem." Well, it won't fix the problem of players getting frustrated over not being able to find a weapon. I can play fine with 30 second respawn time in TDM, but I do strongly believe we should give the 20 seconds a run for its money.

    Who's down with me? We should set up a TDM mode in the HUBS and try this out.
    Steam
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  • #2
    I think going the direction that quakelive did is a better solution than decreased spawn times, it might work fine and make the game more dynamic as there's more things to time though (not more but more often), or it might make the experience feel more ffa'ish with so many more weapons available on the map. Who knows until we can test it

    You know yourself in quakelive for casual team death match a player can select a primary and secondary weapon, such as shotgun and rocket launcher with limited ammo and spawn with them so they don't need to go looking for a weapon, but the core experience of it remains intact, just softer. They can still run around pickup armor, more weapons etc.
    Last edited by nuxx; 06-19-2015, 11:24 AM.

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    • #3
      Originally posted by nuxx View Post
      I think going the direction that quakelive did is a better solution than decreased spawn times, it might work fine and make the game more dynamic as there's more things to time though (not more but more often), or it might make the experience feel more ffa'ish with so many more weapons available on the map. Who knows until we can test it

      You know yourself in quakelive for casual team death match a player can select a primary and secondary weapon, such as shotgun and rocket launcher with limited ammo and spawn with them so they don't need to go looking for a weapon, but the core experience of it remains intact, just softer. They can still run around pickup armor, more weapons etc.
      I was never a fan of load out system in Quake live. It never hurts to test different spawn times in UT. 20 seconds isn't too bad. Alot of players just control the 4 most powerful weapons anyhow in UT.
      Steam
      irc.globalgamers.net #galaxy #unrealtournament #ut4pugs
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      gg! Galaxy Gaming Community


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      • #4
        Yeah it wont hurt to test it out for sure. I completely agree it's a hard game type for new players to get into

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        • #5
          Current respawn timer feels mostly good for me, i would not lower it no more than 5 secs.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by raLa View Post
            Current respawn timer feels mostly good for me, i would not lower it no more than 5 secs.
            Yeah I was thinking 20-25 seconds would be reasonable. 20 seconds would be a good place to test. If that doesn't feel good, would test 25 next.
            Steam
            irc.globalgamers.net #galaxy #unrealtournament #ut4pugs
            UT Username - nvz
            gg! Galaxy Gaming Community


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            • #7
              I can understand where this is coming from, for new players. But it feels wrong that we have to compromise for that reason while it has worked for many years. The beauty of TDM is controlling a map, and you do that by having players time certain weapons for certain parts of a map etc. Lowering the spawntimers on weapons might destroy that, maybe not, depends how much. I am all for doing stuff so more people get into it the game. But lowering skillgap more and more I do not like, because thats IMO what it is.

              But yeah, if its gonna be changed. Dont do overdo it, 5-7sec MAX.

              /luxxiz
              • Gamer with 14 years of experience in all UT's and many other games.
              • Played competitive at the highest possible levels
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              • #8
                Originally posted by raLa View Post
                Current respawn timer feels mostly good for me, i would not lower it no more than 5 secs.
                I agree with raLa.

                If this idea gets any attention (and I think it should, since it sounds like a good idea), we should try to reduce it by small amounts. Subtle changes in the right direction ftw!
                I'm not a professional TDM player at all, but a mediocre one at best.

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                • #9
                  You can't really make a decision about a specific spawn time in a vacuum, you have to look at the entire game.

                  The current spawn times feel more punishing in this UT than previous ones, which shows an underlying problem.
                  The time to kill has been very short in this game and one of the many negative effects this has is on weapon availability.

                  For any 10/15/20 minute period of time there is a theoretical maximum amount of weapons available to be picked up.
                  Every time a player dies their weapon inventory entirely disappears from the game, apart from the weapon they were holding. Those dropped weapons accumulate in the surviving players.
                  If the dropped weapon is picked up by someone who already had that weapon, even the dropped weapon disappears from the game as it is converted to ammo only.

                  If players live half as long on average, there will be twice as many weapon inventories disappearing.

                  I'm not against faster weapon spawn times (I've even argued for 20 second weapon respawn times in duel), but this is a movement/weapon problem first.

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                  • #10
                    This is fairly obvious stuff but I said I'd point it out and it would be some of the reasons I think changing weapon spawn times might impact the game negatively. It also ties in some of the stuff why I'm against item timers

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                    • #11
                      The reason I've argued for faster weapon spawn times in duel is exactly because of how it reduces the amount of time you have. It puts more pressure on the person in control and needs more careful time management. The staggered mega spawn time in quake has a similar effect on the player and prevents these simple cycles that include both weapons and armors without delay.

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                      • #12
                        It's not helping that the armor is a even 30 and belt 60 - even a 5 second margin makes timing much more difficult over the course of a match

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                        • #13
                          I am against... TDM is all about timing, positioning and map control. Who is able to "close the map" will win. 30 sec is just right, less value will break the positioning in TDM. You need to keep your area safe, and fight for the items (belt, amp) in between, even 30sec is too little sometimes.

                          Making gameplay easier for newcomers will kill that game. It's a bad way. Just look at starcraft 2 - a way harder game than ut, and there are a lot of players. It's not the reason why ut series has so few newcomers.
                          Last edited by rAge.; 06-19-2015, 04:15 PM.
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                          • #14
                            There could be room for tweaking it, i think 20 seconds is too low though. 27.5 worked fine in the other games, so 25 probably would too. The difference is noticeable, even if its just a couple of seconds give or take

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                            • #15
                              I might give TDM a shot if weapons spawn every 20 seconds or less.
                              For me TDM always felt boring in ut2k4 as most of the time you were running around with shieldgun raised because the assault rifle was useless and all the other weapons were allready taken.

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