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    FPS/RTS game mode

    I am big fan of FPS/RTS games and I believe that Unreal Tournament would be very good base for game like this.

    I have this in mind:

    Gameplay:
    Two teams try to destroy each other’s base.
    Firstly they start with vehicle that deploys into the main building, which then provides more construction options, effectively starting the tech tree.
    For construction or purchase of anything, team needs credits.
    At the start, team would have limited amount for first few buildings, but would then have to gather resources from the map to get additional credits.
    I’m thinking lore-wise setting for the mode could be about gathering raw liquid material which is used to make nanoblack (I hope I didn’t rape lore too much there), but we still have to find reason for two groups to fight each other.

    One team wins when all buildings from the other team are destroyed.

    I am basically trying to think of the way to get the best combination of Renegade X core gameplay and Savage 2 core gameplay
    http://renx.wiki/wiki/Command_%26_Conquer
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Savage..._Soul#Gameplay


    Buildings:
    • Main construction base
      (needed to build other buildings)
    • Power Plant
      (or equivalent UT-sounding name, Tarydium reactor)
    • Building that converts into credits the resources that harvester dumped in it.
    • Building that allows for the purchase of somewhat more advanced infantry.
    • Building that produces vehicles.
    • Building that produces aircraft.
    • If water would be an option on maps, then maybe even naval units / submarines.
    • Communication centre that would enable/improve minimap or communication options among teammates.
      (maybe even enable voice-chat, have it disabled otherwise)
    • Tech building that enables buildings to produce tech tree tier 2 units.


    Classes:
    • Engineer
      Uses enforcer for basic self defense
      Has repair tool, which is basically reskinned link gun that has secondary-fire-lazor-ray-beam as primary fire, but this beam does negative damage (read: heals) to allies and team’s objects (buildings, vehicles)
    • Sniper
      Enforcer for basic self defense
      Sniper rifle
      (maybe spawns with helmet)
    • Rocketdude
      Rocket launcher for some serious damage
      Link gun with only pew pew pew primary fire for when rockets are too slow
    • Infiltrator
      Shock rifle
      Can become invisible for some time


    I am sure we can think of some more interesting classes.


    Vehicles:
    • Whatever vehicles / aircraft gets added in the game for other game modes that use vehicles
    • Harvester
      One per team is controlled by AI and goes for nearest available resource point.
      Team members can buy additional harvesters that have to be human-driven.
      (I would say max 2 extra harvesters at the time)


    Maps:
    • I would prefer big open areas



    I would really like to hear your feedback on this very rough incomplete idea.
    I made this Google doc so that feedback / suggestions / ideas get tracked in one place and therefore not get lost/forgotten somewhere in thread:
    https://docs.google.com/document/d/1...it?usp=sharing
    Last edited by Testman42; 04-11-2016, 05:32 PM.

    #2
    Is the harvester the vehicle that produces pumpkin heads?
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    Comment


      #3
      [MENTION=11932]Testman42[/MENTION] I too am a huge fan of FPS/RTS, and had been thinking about this game mode too once vehicles become available as the FPS part will be very polished by the time its finished.

      I've always found every FPS/RTS that I played lacking. What would be your top 3 and why? Are their any that are in development that have caught your eye? Universum looks interesting, but I'd rather help build this for UT4

      I would suggest adding all classes from TF2 straight away.

      Also, adding some monster classes which become user playable.

      I'll update the Google docs shortly.

      This will be AWESOME
      Another crazy idea brought to you by richardboegli ;P

      Comment


        #4
        Updated Google Docs with following suggestions:
        Classes
        • All classes as per TFS


        Vehicles
        • APC for carrying troops
        • Chinook or osprey or a UT equivalent for carrying troops
          • Thinking something like the Raptor for UT3, but with space to carry troops



        Abilities / Extra weapons / Addons
        • To facilitate air deployment
          • Parachute
          • Hand glider
          • Zip line

        Last edited by richardboegli; 03-19-2016, 02:58 AM.
        Another crazy idea brought to you by richardboegli ;P

        Comment


          #5
          Updated Google Docs with following suggestions:

          Vehicles
          • Large battle robots modelled / adapted from:
            • Heavy Gears
            • Titans (Titanfall)
            • Mechwarriors
          Another crazy idea brought to you by richardboegli ;P

          Comment


            #6
            For examples I would look into a game called "nuclear dawn"
            The concept of the game is amazing, it just lacked.. uh.. everything else....
            [MENTION=259874]richardboegli[/MENTION] I don't think there should be new vehicles for this game-mode, by the time any work is put into creating even a prototype, there should already be a few base vehicles that the community plays and understands
            IMO you should leave the modded vehicles to modded maps, as in, if you want to introduce a new vehicle that has special abilities, create it for the map with its own spawn points e.t.c
            Then you can put the model up for other people to include into their maps

            Classes/addons: TF2 seems like a good place to pull classes from, I would rather that the "heavy" class was normal speed and faster classes would simply have boosts. As for addons, I'm not sure about your ideas, would prefer something closer to core gameplay, but will not refuse to try it out if a prototype appears

            As for resource collection, it would be nice to get boosts from kills, however, the main problem that you end up with in RTS is that when one player starts winning, they begin to dominate the game. Perhaps a few loser advantages would be nice?

            I'm quite doubtful this will become a thing before 2017, but as long as there is Linux support, I will test out anything you give

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by richardboegli View Post
              I've always found every FPS/RTS that I played lacking. What would be your top 3 and why? Are their any that are in development that have caught your eye? Universum looks interesting, but I'd rather help build this for UT4
              Lacking in what way? My problem with FPS/RTS hybrids is that most of them have dead multiplayer.

              I would say that my top 3 are those:

              1. Renegade X
                (Some of following arguments were already present in C&C Renegade, but I think RenX is better example for that argument)
                +Command and Conquer themed game. I'm huge C&C fan.
                +Interesting vehicles
                +Good economy (many ways to get credits)
                -No base construction, only base destruction
                -not well refined commander interface as of yet
              2. Savage 2
                +Base construction
                Usually only commander can construct buildings
                There is class that can construct buildings in case that team has no commander
                Bad thing about this is that irresponsible player can waste team credits
                +Squad team structure
                +Integrated voice chat that takes squad structure in account (diffrent key binds for talk to squad or talk to everyone)
                -No flying units
              3. I would love to say Natural Selection 2, but I don't own it on Steam and I haven't played it enough to give detailed opinion, so I would have to go with Nuclear Dawn
                +Decent commander interface
                +Decent resource gathering and expansion mechanic
                -No vehicles, no air units
                -Maps not open enough IMHO (same would go for NS2)

                I also played first Savage, C&C Renegade, Tiberium Sun Reborn, Red Alert: A Path Beyond, and I would argue that in some aspects even Planetside 2 could be considered FPS/RTS hybrid.


              Am I correct to assume that Universum that you mentioned has become WARSHIFT?

              I think that it would be easier for people to get into FPS/RTS game if they already know weapons / vehicles from somewhere else, so having FPS/RTS mode in UT would require less learning than if game was completely new.

              Originally posted by MarkTheF4rth View Post
              I'm quite doubtful this will become a thing before 2017, but as long as there is Linux support, I will test out anything you give
              Oh yes, I agree that this idea of mine is very long-term. There are much more important things to be made for UT than experimental game modes right now.
              And I am also a Linux user, and run games on Linux whenever possible. But I don't want to go full Stallman and not play the games that I would enjoy just because they are not available on Linux, so I dual-boot with Windows (Linux partition is way bigger than Windows).

              Comment


                #8
                Kind of like in Titanfall it could have a dynamic between 3 different kinds of units: numerous, fast, and big.

                Numerous: The main battle stands between bots playing as regular troops, robots and small aliens under the command of the RTS players.
                Fast: The FPS players play as highly skilled mercenaries. They are fast, versatile and unpredictable. It's their job to sabotage the operations of regular enemy troops and hunt down enemy mercenaries before they manage to disrupt friendly operations.
                Big: Winning side objectives such as collecting resources gives the FPS players access to vehicles and big aliens. When driving a vehicle or playing as a big alien you sacrifice speed, agility and versatility in exchange for specialization and raw power.

                Comment


                  #9
                  So after MOBA UT, we will go with FPRTS UT ? Noice !

                  Personally I see two big "type" of RTS/FPS hybrids :

                  -The quick like, more oriented with infantries. Games like Natural Selection 2 and Tremulous (not sure a lot of people know this one). They fit better with the basics of UT in my opinion, because they are relatively fast, don't need large maps to fit vehicles (most of the maps are corridor and arcade like), and still give an important tactical sense and commanding possibility. I also feel like the classes in them are more flexibles. You all have the same base character, and have access to all stuff (if you have the buildings and ressources), but you can truely choose what role to assume and adapt at any given time, and so switch quickly to meet the need of your team.

                  -The large and slower scaled, including vehicles. They are interesting in their own way too, but requires larger maps and the addition of vehicles to work. Also it can take way longer to play and generally ask for mre players to give the true feeling of an important warfare. And it's sometimes more difficult to manage for "commanders" as they can't direct so much player (and sometimes AIs) at the same time. It's kind of... messy. Yet I had my fun with these as well, like Battlezone 2, Savage 2, and some obscure mods that I forgot the names !

                  Maybe it's possible to work on the first model, and then with these basic mechanics we can later combine them with vehicular modes to do the second model ?

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Don't forget the UT mod "Siege". Can't find a download link, but there's plenty of videos. There's a moddb page for Siege 3 for UT3, but it seems to have never made it to release.



                    The best FPSS I've ever played was Empires, a HL2 mod.
                    First, it had a tickets system similar to Battlefield. This was needed for players to respawn and would never increase, making it a finite resource pool for infantry and pilots that was separate from the replenishable resources used for buildings and vehicles. Using or not wasting your team's tickets was a long term strategic decision, as you could have that many more (or fewer) lives to spend later on in the game for suicide runs or desperate pushes, when other resources get low. In some ways, this made Empires even more strategic than most RTS games, because those games get lost in the tactical minutiae and long term strategic decisions are dissolved into the "meta".
                    Second, there was the Commander vehicle. This gave the commander a physical presence on the battlefield, and also made your victory condition mobile. Aggressive commanders could need frequent rescuing, a tradeoff for the advantage of having a free armored vehicle and construction zone. It also allowed for some absurd RTS-like outcomes, such as early tower rushes or base trades, because losing your main base was not game ending so long as your CV was free to drive away.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Originally posted by Darkloser View Post
                      Maybe it's possible to work on the first model, and then with these basic mechanics we can later combine them with vehicular modes to do the second model ?
                      That would seem the most optimal approach to implementation of the idea. Good thinking.

                      Also, I believe that Tremulous is a bit dead, but Unvanquished is the one that holds the torch right now.

                      Originally posted by Dementiurge View Post
                      This gave the commander a physical presence on the battlefield
                      I like the idea of commander still being on the battlefield, but having the interface that allows for top-down view of the map.
                      Maybe compensate commander by allowing control of one or two bots.
                      Savage 2 did something like this, where commander could have up to 3 weak AI workers to help him build the base.

                      Also, what do you guys think of this idea:
                      What if some basic infantry units came in squads?
                      So that if player purchases the most basic infantry unit, 2-3 AI bots of same unit spawn next to him and follow him around.
                      Of course if map is big enough, so that it does not get too crowded.
                      That is where the roster of team-mates from base UT game could come in play (that thing where we completed challenges to get stars and better AI team-mates)
                      Units that spawn with player have the stats of best AIs in player's roster.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        Yes Tremulous is dead now, and Unvanquished is it's successor. But there's nobody on it.

                        I would like to avoid using any AI or bots. It makes gameplay incredibly boring or insanely difficult (sometimes both). They can be too hard to balance properly, and in all honesty if I'm looking to play with AI I'll search for either a solo oriented game or a true RTS game. Don't want to see what Titanfall have done.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by Testman42 View Post
                          Lacking in what way? My problem with FPS/RTS hybrids is that most of them have dead multiplayer.
                          Yep. This and I have found the FPS element always to be quite lacking.

                          Originally posted by Testman42 View Post
                          Am I correct to assume that Universum that you mentioned has become WARSHIFT?
                          Yes...this is what I meant....

                          Originally posted by Testman42 View Post
                          I think that it would be easier for people to get into FPS/RTS game if they already know weapons / vehicles from somewhere else, so having FPS/RTS mode in UT would require less learning than if game was completely new.
                          Exactly.

                          Focus on having a solid FPS mechanic, weapons and vehicles, then the RTS can be built over the top.
                          Another crazy idea brought to you by richardboegli ;P

                          Comment


                            #14
                            I am very very slow.
                            If RTS stands for Real time strategy, and this game is Unreal Tournament, why wouldn't the game mode be called Unreal Time Strategy?

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