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Why do dodge-ramps only seem to work 50% of the time or less?

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    [BUG] Why do dodge-ramps only seem to work 50% of the time or less?

    I've been having this issue ever since I started playing UT4, I'm surprised I haven't seen anyone complain about it. Does it only happen to me or something?
    Anyway, it happens offline and online and it seems to happen when the player is in contact with a 90 degree wall as they slide up a slope.
    The video shows how unreliable it is to use the sloped ramp thingy. For me anyway.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ZEu_YB2UAo

    Oh right, I guess I showed explain what the problem is lel. While sliding upward on a ramp, your momentum has a 50% chance to dead stop, regardless of how fast you're moving.
    It's kind of annoying when a certain movement only has a chance of functioning correctly, especially in a game of which movement fluidity is one of the most important factors.
    Last edited by 83R; 06-25-2017, 12:58 AM.

    #2
    It seems to me that it is critical that we must press jump before apex of ramp, (pressing and holding jump if we actually want any air like the first jump in video, but you probably know that part.) Also keeping angle to ramp seems to affect outcome (similar in effect that if you rotate your pawn too much away from parallel to a wall for a wall slide, the action breaks or does not start. Now that I think of it, you may be pressing in a forward direction along the 90° wall and your pawn is going into the wall slide move which is what is breaking the upward momentum.

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      #3
      Ah, I actually did not know that. But, I still think that is more complicated that it should be. For instance, in any other UT game and in Unreal 1 or 2, all the player has to do is dodge into the slope; I figured that since dodging into ramps has been the same in all of the other games in the franchise, why would they now decide to make it more complicated by making the player hold jump and sliding along the wall at a certain angle? Holding jump to use the ramp is also more difficult for me since I use arrow keys.

      Honestly, I don't understand the last part of your post, "Also keeping angle to ramp seems to affect outcome (similar in effect that if you rotate your pawn too much away from parallel to a wall for a wall slide, the action breaks or does not start. Now that I think of it, you may be pressing in a forward direction along the 90° wall and your pawn is going into the wall slide move which is what is breaking the upward momentum." So, does that mean momentum was being broken because holding jump caused the character to engage in a wall run but fail at it, thus, making it look like momentum comes to a dead stop? Or does it have something to do with the angle that the player is sliding against the wall? Or something else?

      I wasn't holding jump when I dodged onto the ramp because I didn't I'm supposed to.

      Comment


        #4
        Yes, I think we may be accidentally going into wall slides. Wall slide does not work unless pawn is close to parallel with wall, so maybe try to avoid/not avoid that to test the theory. also avoid forward key (maybe even backward key, I forget if backward wall slide is possible.) That first jump in your video looked like jumps I've only made if I held jump after contact with the ramp. I am not sure if this boost comes from pressing/holding jump after contact with ramp or having it held at right moment during mantling movement which comes into effect when our pawns feet nears top of an object (like quake2/SMB mantle jump), or if it is just hop/high jump decision that happens with rest of jump moves depending how long jump is held. I most first-person games this many movement options with jump on mouse key, so on Unreal series I use spacebar for alt-fire.

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          #5
          I've been meaning to post about this as well, it's damned annoying. I can't get up even the smallest ramps, so I have to dodge off the wall nearby, but get stuck. Not sure about this wall slide mechanic, you mean wall run?

          Here's what I mean: https://youtu.be/u8RaUPMc1Fs
          Last edited by Calypto; 06-26-2017, 05:43 AM.
          UT2004 Movement Mutator

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            #6
            Yes, "wall run" is the one I meant. However, today after revisiting the dodge-jump to wall-dodge jump to the shieldbelt in DM-Antiquus I was practicing when I first encountered this difficulty; I made very many dodges into the ramp wall without any mouse movement, without any movement except double taps to the ramp. I see that when I fail into the momentum stop, it seems it is more because I was not in dodge either yet or anymore when initially hitting the ramp. For myself, I think this may mean I need to increase my double-tap time allowance for dodge versus previous engines. I did not retry the experiment yet with the single-dodge button feature available in late releases (that would take even more getting accustomed to...)

            Comment


              #7
              Interesting, in my video, on the first ramp, I dodged into the ramp, then let go of any movement keys, then double tapped the direction that is perpendicular to the wall when I was near the peak of my upward momentum. But, on the second ramp, I held forward the whole time, and tapped right 4 times so that I'd dodge into the ramp and then wall dodge. I never press or hold jump when I use ramps since jumping into the ramp doesn't give a good boost and there doesn't seem to be a reason to hold jump.

              In this video, I showed that the problem still happens even if I hold jump without touching the movement keys, hold jump and hold the movement key that is perpendicular to the wall, hold the movement key that is perpendicular to the wall without holding jump, without touching any keys, and holding forward but not holding jump.
              https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cZyLAITCd74

              Comment


                #8
                This and other ramp dodge bugs have been known to be in the game for literally 3 years now, I wouldn't expect fixes soon.

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                  #9
                  Don't you have to dodge before touching the edge of the ramp for max height? I need to check on whether that was the case but I remember something about ramp jumps being different if you touched the ramp before dodging into it.

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                    #10
                    Welp, I just tested that, I dodged into the ramp but I was about 5-10 feet away from it and I still got the same result--upward momentum=gone. Heh, I remember this problem since I started playing UT4 for the first time back in 2014, and the devs have said nothing about it, as if, they don't even know it's a problem. Makes me wonder if they ever look at the UT4 forums.
                    Last edited by 83R; 06-27-2017, 04:11 PM.

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                      #11
                      This has been an issue since 2014.I think they were made aware of it a long time ago, don't think its a priority.

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                        #12
                        As a level designer I discovered that this doesn't happen when the apex of the ramp doesn't exactly meet the wall, eg there is a small space between or ledge on top of ramp. Not ideal but temp workaround.
                        Maps: DM-Dying_Sun WIP & DM-TokaraSwamp
                        www.shockandrockets.com

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                          #13
                          Originally posted by 83R View Post
                          Welp, I just tested that, I dodged into the ramp but I was about 5-10 feet away from it and I still got the same result--upward momentum=gone. Heh, I remember this problem since I started playing UT4 for the first time back in 2014, and the devs have said nothing about it, as if, they don't even know it's a problem. Makes me wonder if they ever look at the UT4 forums.
                          That is too far away. I mean that you can't be running into the ramp, you can't be touching it when the dodge is initiated. But you have to be close too, say a foot at most. Still I have to experiment with this my self.

                          Comment


                            #14
                            This problem almost broke my DM-Quest ... I was pretty devestated at the time as ramps were crucial to the layout. I did come up with a bypass which is not to conjoin the ramp completely to the wall at the peak. Before I did that it was that issue of being pushed right back down sometimes when hitting the vertical walls.

                            http://i.imgur.com/zorGGda.jpg

                            I totally agree with your 50/50 statement. That is exactly how it feels and its super frustrating in a map with lots of ramps. There are plenty of maps that suffer from this problem and it would be infuriating to have it happen in a duel where every second counts...
                            Last edited by Ransom8316075924; 06-29-2017, 08:53 AM.
                            AKA ||Ransom from Absolute clan.
                            I have a WIP map. DM-Mosnar on Absolute Atlanta Hub

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                              #15
                              Don't hold the movement direction into the wall. Once you dodge, stop holding a movement key until you mantle, or kick.
                              Originally posted by Mysterial
                              An instant hit, accurate, instant kill weapon is overpowered. There's no skill ceiling. It's limited only by the shooter's accuracy. It also severely impairs the defensive side of the game - ignoring ping, it is nearly irrelevant what your opponent does - click the right pixel and you win. Even non-instant kill instant hit weapons are often problematic - the Shock Rifle example is obvious before even getting to other games.

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