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Mix and match. Dispersion Pistol+Enforcer = Dispersion Enforcer

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    Mix and match. Dispersion Pistol+Enforcer = Dispersion Enforcer

    I had this idea a long while back during Gooba's thread in designing his Enforcer concept we have now but it seemed that the idea got quickly passed over since the thread was about the artwork which is totally understandable.

    PHASE ONE - THE WEAPON MODES

    Originally posted by FirebornForm View Post
    • LC = Enforcer bullets(Hitscan). Hold for repeated fire.
    • LC Hold +Tap RC = Faster enforcer bullets, either burst fire or gansta mode

    • RC = Dispersion projectiles single energy shot(projectile) Hold RC=Charge fire (larger projectile) ((holds indefinitely or only for so long))
    PHASE TWO - WEAPON BALANCE
    Originally posted by FirebornForm View Post
    Next up I want to cover balance.
    Primary = Fast low damage (20 or under)
    Secondary = Slow high damage (25 or over)
    PHASE THREE - ADDING VALUE TO THE ENFORCER
    Originally posted by FirebornForm View Post
    Enforcer bullet mode = No tracer, or very small and short. not the long string it is now. This lets players miss without being punished, or promotes a more useful ability to pick off or pester players via quick stealthy shots.
    Enforcer dispersion mode = Remove Epic's "Stopping Power" from Enforcer bullets against Impact Hammers only and add it to everything effected by the dispersion projectile.
    Keep reading for a very in depth look at the game design choices around this.

    So I'm going to go into more depth this time around giving this idea some proper time for people to digest. Some people don't like how the Enforcer in Gooba's artwork looks like a laser gun, due to the curved and sleeker shapes than the Enforcer has ever had. I'm personally cool with the design as a more sleek version but there was some other topics brought up in people's distaste for the concept. A good many of Gooba's designs for the Enforcer had blue glowing lights of some kind that served no purpose other than looking cool, and that they did...

    Of course that got me thinking about what if the things people complain about having no purpose actually DID have a purpose? We just have to change how the Enforcer works.

    I've seen quite a number of people having some nostalgia for the dispersion pistol from the original Unreal 1, it's been asked, requested and talked about enough that I think there's SOME kind of demand for it. Of course people bring up the topic of completely replacing the Enforcer and then we have people who say the dispersion pistol sucks for arena shooters and they would probably be right... IF you only used it as it was how it was designed in Unreal 1. Remember they were all originally Unreal 1 weapons, UT just made them more deadly. Like the Ripjack becoming the Ripper. The enforcer of UT was originally the Automag in Unreal 1 but it seems like the Dispersion Pistol has been long abandoned and no one wants to go back aside from the occasional visit to nostalgia land.

    It's pretty much a tradition for every Unreal game UT or otherwise to get a new iteration of the starting weapons.
    Unreal 1 never had the impact hammer and had the dispersion pistol instead.
    UT introduced the hammer and dropped the dispersion pistol, and gave you the automag (enforcer) which you could fire faster turned sideways.
    Unreal 2 also had the dispersion pistol but I'm not sure if it's functionality changed at all because I've never played the game and I can't find any videos of it.
    UT2K replaced the hammer with the shield gun changing the mechanics, and changed the enforcer to a assault gun rapid fire but completely weak and gave secondary a launch-able grenade
    UT3 returned the enforcer but gave it a burst fire secondary and dropped the grenades. A sort of in-between the standard fire of the Enforcer UT99 and Assault rifle UT2K

    So far in UT4 we don't have any new tools (Weapon mechanics) to learn and master.
    So why don't we start adding stuff in the spirit of UT DNA. Mixing the old with the new!

    This methodology has been done before like mixing the old (Stinger) with the new (Minigun) explosive shots

    I present you the Enforcer Dispersion Pistol or whatever you wanna call it! Dispersion Enforcer is what I got for now.

    PHASE ONE

    I took pre-existing concepts or models that've been done before. (Unreal 1, 2, UT99) and applied some logic to the concept art Gooba made. Gooba's design has some pretty strong similarities to some dispersion pistols and maybe if the Enforcer was ALSO a Dispersion Pistol then people would be much more accepting to the design? That's the theory anyway!


    Let's look at some traits for the weapons.

    Dispersion Pistol
    • Has a rounded design
    • Dark Gray/Black metallic surface
    • Slow moving Projectiles
    • Energy Shots, these are pretty slow moving and not a good idea to replace the enforcer with such a cripplingly slow firing would probably
    • *Fires blue energy. No other gun in UT fires blue energy! The closest to this would be Shock's purple energy but it's still a good distance blue vs purple for it to be recognizable.
    • *Has an infinite supply of ammo that replenishes. You will pretty much never need to worry about running out.
    • *Secondary fire is charge-able firing a larger more damaging energy projectile.
    • *Secondary is charge-able indefinitely.
    • **It morphs into a more powerful version of itself, once this happens the beams change color as to show the new power.


    EnforcerUT99
    • Has a blocky design
    • Dark green and gray
    • Fast moving Hitscan
    • **Bullets, nothing unique or special about it here. Though in UT3 placeholder effects they have a trail so I suppose there's some coolness factor?
    • Has a finite supply of a medium sized bunch of ammo. You will need to pick up ammo around for the enforcer.
    • Secondary just fires faster in older UTs or fires a burst of 3 shots in UT3 placeholder UT4.


    Assault Rifle UT2K
    • Automatic fire on hold, fires rapid hitscan
    • Really weak, much more so than the old UT99 Enforcer due to weapon balance of rapid fire.
    • *Secondary is charge-able indefinitely.
    • **Had a charge-able grenade launcher that could be fired fast and long distances.


    So these are what's been done before and what we've got to work with in terms of mixing old and new. For the sake of basic discussion of the weapon I'll only be focusing on important unique * features and throwing out other unique features **

    Before moving on from the Assault Rifle...
    I wan't to cover how the Assault Rifle was an incredibly awful weapon in terms of weapon design for a starting gun. It was so weak you'd practically never kill anyone with it's main fire. In comparison to UT99 and UT3 you can actually get kills with the Enforcer if you just play good and out gun (out aim) them while dodging their shots. Good luck doing that with the Assault Riffle... you're better off running away with the shield gun until you get to a better weapon. Point goes to UT99 Enforcer being far better than the Assault Rifle as a starting weapon.

    There is however one important thing to note about the Assault Rifle, and that's its secondary function as a grenade launcher. You really get minimal shots so it's still not that great but it can be a game changer on dealing with someone if you manage to pop a grenade in their face. You can also sneak a grenade by someone as it rolls and slides into their feet while their eyes will be up top focusing on your body it's a good possibility they'll miss it, until it hits them. Grenades can be lobbed long distances or bounced off walls around corners. It's this point of the Assault Rifle is where it shines, while the primary is a god awful pea shooter the secondary is multifunctional and can be used in many different ways. You may only get a few shots with it but you can do quite a lot of creative kills with the grenades. Point goes to UT2K for being a far more versatile weapon.

    It's that versatility that I want to talk about here. My goal is to bring more versatility and use to the Enforcer in UT4.
    The Enforcer from UT99 is not versatile, yet every other weapon in the game is. To me this always made me have a kind of sour spot for the Enforcer, the Impact hammer can have multiple uses such as deflection and transversing, pegging people with instant death hits or knocking them off an edge... all of the other weapons have a secondary which changes the function of the weapon but the Enforcer never got anything. Likewise the enforcer in UT3 isn't versatile either and thus it's the lamest weapon even more so than the hammer. In UT4 there's a tiny bit more options added to the gun but only to stop someone charging at you with the impact hammer.

    I want the Enforcer to feel more like it fits within the Unreal Universe meaning giving it some extra flair. There's a whole bunch of ways to go about this but for now I'm going to talk about adding the dispersion pistol to the Enforcer.

    Why add the Dispersion Pistol as a secondary fire to the Enforcer?
    Key differences between the DP and ENF are their ammo and their methods of hitting someone. Consider this!

    • It's Newbie friendly infinite ammo allows them to pretty much fire until they die or grab a new gun. A good number of time's I've seen people run dry with all of their ammo and they are left with no choice but to either come at me with a hammer or run away for another gun. When people come at you with a hammer only it's pretty easy to just peg them down and get a kill.
    • It can add some strategy to using the gun, much like how you fire a slow moving fireball in Street Fighter to get your opponent to move you can control their movement by shooting an area with a bunch of slow moving projectiles and then switch to primary fire and fire away via normal bullets. (How fast or slow the projectile moves is up to devs for balance)
    • The DP has always fired blue shots and no other gun uses it, it will bring some more color to the game with some lightning effects for fun. UT Devs can have some extra fun designing a slick dispersion projectile, and they get to show off more of the UE4 Engine!
    • It's a good idea to have your starting weapons be a beginner level to the rest of the weapons. Much like impact jumping is supposed to be a beginners rocket jump. By having two different kinds of shots (Hitscan and Projectile) it teaches the player that not all shots (or firing modes!) get equal results and infact get very very different results with totally different mechanics! This is true for practically every gun in UT, you have to learn each mode and master them in itself. Having only one mode of fire (Hitscan and hitscan) does nothing to adding depth and to prepare players for drastically different mechanics.
    • Like how Enforcer (Hitscan) is a newbie version of the Sniper, the secondary mode as a dispersion shot would be like a beginner version of projectiles, particularly the shock ball and link gun primary. Teaching the player how to lead shots earlier on while they spawn with the weapon each time. is a good idea
    • It adds logic to Gooba Enforcer design having blue powercells for no other reason!
    • It brings a new tool to the table and something new for us to master.


    Okay, so what to do with the other secondary modes?
    Personally if it's required to keep the secondary mode of the UT3 enforcer I would just make it the primary mode. Much like in rockets you can hold fire to load 3 at once, or just tap to fire once. I'd apply the same game-logic here. Tap for 1 shot at a time, hold for burst fire. It seems pretty straight forward. If people want to conserve ammo and do small peg shots they can, but holding down the fire would do continuous 3 burst shots until they run out of ammo. It's very common for new players to just hold the mouse button down and "aim". This would at least give them a more fair chance instead of the slow firemode of old-enforcer primary, burst mode can kill an enemy much faster. Of course there's the case where it wont help them and instead they will just end up burning ammo being a sitting duck but that's where the DP secondary comes into play.

    Honestly I doubt it would be too necessary to have burst fire after you have the added ability of the secondary dispersion mode.

    Now you might think that they would just go holding down the fire mode of rightclick to spam the dispersion mode but you forget one of the main things about the dispersion pistol! What I'm talking about is how you charge it indefinitely. So instead of getting to spam the right button like they did on the left button it would instead start charging and won't fire until released. Why I would make it charge forever is due to being able to get the drop on people, but if this is too much overlap with Bio and Impact (Both charge indefinitely) then it's fine with having it fire after a period of time passes.

    TL;DR it works like this.
    • Primary = Enforcer mode
    • tap=Single bullet (hitscan)
      [Maybe if necessary] hold=Burst fire (multi-hitscan)((continuous after delay))

    • Secondary = Dispersion mode
    • tap=Single energy (projectile)
      hold=Charge fire (larger projectile) ((holds indefinitely or only for so long))


    I have more to talk about how to make the gun more interesting but that's beyond basic functionality and will be covered in PHASE TWO. I'll update this thread when I get around to writing that for now this is just the basic concept to explore the idea of merging the dispersion pistol with the enforcer!

    =====================================================================================================================================================================

    EDIT:
    Originally posted by FirebornForm View Post
    PHASE TWO Next up I want to cover balance.

    Enforcer
    UT99 = 6 shot kill (classic) Roughly around 15-17 damage
    15-30-45-60-75-90

    UT99 = 4 shot kill (hardcore) 25 damage.
    25-50-75-100

    UT4 = 5 shot kill (hardcore) 20-22 damage the same as UT3's Enforcer.
    20-40-60-80-100

    Since alt fire is redundant... that means the only difference is the fire rate.
    So you can kill people twice as fast with gansta mode if you are close to them.
    In addition, you can kill people twice as fast with dual enforcers from a distance, or four times as fast with dual enforcer gansta mode again at closer range.

    In comparison to the redundant UT3 burst mode you can rack up to 90 damage in a very short period of time IF you connect your shots. I think the problem with UT3's mode is that it's deceptive. It seems like it will work longer range but it sucks at long range, you also don't have much room for error once you start firing where as the alt fire gansta mode is more correctable and newb-friendly when you can keep the fire button down. Spraying is a common thing new players do before learning how to aim precisely and I think having the enforcer be noob friendly is very important if they're going to be dying and starting with it again and again.

    Dispersion/Pulse UT99
    I think taking the Dispersion Gun verbatim will never work, and thats why people always say it sucks. So I'm instead taking the old pulse rifle and retooling it for the Enforcer secondary, my best look at what will work for the Dispersion mode is the old Pulse rifle. It fits all of the bills, it's been tested in a UT setting and it's always been the slowest projectile. This fits nicely with DP being the slowest projectile. All people have to do is tweak the link gun primary, remake it to the pulse gun, color it blue and stick it on the enforcer as a secondary.

    Of course the spam-ability of pulse is another thing to discuss but for now I'm only interested in the damage and the projectile speed.

    UT99 = 5 shot kill (classic) 20 damage
    UT99 = 4 shot kill (hardcore) 25 damage

    Since we're building around hardcore balance, the DP secondary mode MUST be more than 20 damage of the Enforcer primary or no one would ever use it. This would help address people saying the enforcer is too **** weak if the secondary is a more powerful option. For the sake of easy punching in numbers we already know works, I'd say just try out using 25 damage for secondary dispersion mode for now as the bar minimum.

    This way people get this.
    Primary = Fast low damage (20)
    Secondary = Slow high damage (25+)
    EDIT 2:
    Originally posted by FirebornForm View Post
    PHASE THREE - Adding value to the enforcer and reducing redundancy with other weapons.

    Enforcer bullet mode = No tracer, or very small and short. not the long string it is now.
    It's far too easy to spot someone firing an Enforcer at you. This makes the weapon incredibly punishing to use, and not new player friendly. If they missed, they just gave away their position with a BIG streak much like the Stinger and Sniper. For the Sniper and the Minigun it makes more sense because they are pretty high power weapons but the Enforcer is anything but high-powered and we've got one of the weaker iterations of it in UT4 with 20 damage. Since it's not very powerful, it shouldn't share these traits with the other more powerful guns.

    As an added bonus, and part of a weapon balance. Removing the LONG trails of the Enforcer bullets will let people miss without instantly punishing them for doing so, and let's them try to fire again. On the flip side, players who have strong aiming skills will be able to get "sneak attacks" in without basically suicide like what comes at firing at someone with a trail... A gun with no trace-able trail carries the benefits of letting players be stealthy. The Sniper originally had this FX but as we see already, it doesn't anymore. The sniper has much larger benefits and power over the Enforcer since it carries a higher risk reward with the trail. But the Enforcer is drastically more risk than reward when it has a trail. For a starter-weapon it should not punish the player for using it so severely.

    Enforcer dispersion mode = Remove Epic's "Stopping Power" from Enforcer bullets against Impact Hammers only and add it to everything effected by the dispersion projectile.
    This makes the gun have more strategic use and the player gets consistent results instead of a weird "Well stopping power only applies if someones charging at you with a hammer" rule. If they hit someone with the slowest projectile possible, it should carry some sort of reward. An extra damage is nice, but if you want to encourage them to use it more often, stopping power will show them immediate differences without them even needing to see your HP. This helps reinforce the notion that the secondary dispersion projectile is more powerful, as it's stopping people in their tracks.

    How much stopping power, slowing power or stunning power can be configured and toyed with for testing the weapon to find the best balance from being ranging useless to overpowered. A happy medium should be met!
    Last edited by FirebornForm; 10-16-2014, 11:12 PM.

    #2
    Fair enough idea. What I'm thinking:

    Primary: Standard fire bullets (hitscan)
    Primary + Alt: Burst or Gangsta bullet fire
    Secondary: Energized projectile
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    Unreal Prime Weapons: Impact Hammer | Enforcer | BioRifle | Shock Rifle | Link Gun | Ripper | Minigun | Flak Cannon | Rocket Launcher | Sniper Rifle | Grenade Launcher | Dispersion Pistol

    Comment


      #3
      I wouldn't want to have it be too complicated with too many modes like what you're suggesting is 5 firing modes.
      1. LC tap = [enf] single fire (Fast shots)
      2. LC hold = [enf] burst fire (Fastest shots with a delay)
      3. LC hold+RC hold? [enf] gansta fire (Faster shots)
      4. RC tap = [dp] single fire (Slow shots)
      5. RC hold = [dp] charge fire (Slower shots)

      The original purpose of "gansta hold" was firing the gun faster. It dated back to the Automag in Unreal 1 and I can't speak for the developers but it just seemed like they were saying "Look how cool and edgy we are, you can gansta style with this gun too!" stuff from the 90s. Since burst fire already covers "firing faster" then gansta fire mode is redundant. As I already covered in analyzing the Enforcer I think it's TOO redundant already I wouldn't want to make it more redundant.

      I don't really think gansta mode deserves it's own spot if burst mode already covers what it "solves". That said, I think gansta is an iconic Unreal Automag/UT Enforcer staple and since we have the Enforcer again in UT4 we should have the Automag/Enforcer mode back. I'd actually take a page out of UT3 for this one (shocking i know!) I think having gansta mode as only when you dual wield it would be alright. Of course we could just drop the burst fire entirely and have gansta fire part of left click while still having dispersion mode right click. So holding fire automatically goes into gansta (faster uncontrolled inaccurate mode) while tapping it is controlled and the gun remains upright.

      That way we have 4 modes with alternating speeds and flip flopped logic.
      1. LC tap = [enf] single fire (Fast and accurate shots)
      2. LC hold = [enf] gansta fire (Held is faster inaccurate shots)
      3. RC tap = [dp] single fire (Slow shots)
      4. RC hold = [dp] charge fire (Held is slower shots)


      On the topic of dual enforcers I think they deserve their own consideration in terms of balance almost separately. The UT99 Enforcer did 25 damage which is quite a lot for a starting gun, but when you had dual enforcers you would basically be unstoppable for a while dealing 50 damage in half the time it takes before so in a couple seconds you would kill someone fully armored. The UT3 Enforcers was pure slaughter when you had two of them even though it was weaker than previous versions the fire rate was increased so you actually killed people faster than in UT99 dual enforcers. Because dual enforcers are such a tricky thing to balance out it might be better to just default them to 1 fire mode per click (LC = always fast inaccurate gangsta fire) otherwise it's too overpowered when you can get twice as fast and accurate shots.

      If four modes is too much power and too many to handle we can start stripping them away.
      1. LC tap = [enf] single fire (holding just repeats fire at same rate automatically like the old enforcer)
      2. RC tap = [dp] single fire
      3. RC hold = [dp] charge fire


      Food for thought.
      Last edited by FirebornForm; 10-13-2014, 04:00 PM.

      Comment


        #4
        Originally posted by FirebornForm View Post
        I wouldn't want to have it be too complicated with too many modes like what you're suggesting is 5 firing modes.
        I am not sure how you manage to get 3 = 5.
        Just to clarify, each line in my post above is corresponding to one thing. I'm not sold that burst fire is all that useful, and gangsta/rapid-fire mode overlaps so much with standard primary fire that it's hard to me to justify putting it as its own firemode, but the overall functionality is useful. Hence trying to utilize multipress.

        I guess it shouldn't be hard to differentiate tap vs. hold functionality but there's nothing like that currently implemented. Thanks for the idea though!
        Last edited by Wail; 10-13-2014, 04:55 PM.
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        Unreal Prime Weapons: Impact Hammer | Enforcer | BioRifle | Shock Rifle | Link Gun | Ripper | Minigun | Flak Cannon | Rocket Launcher | Sniper Rifle | Grenade Launcher | Dispersion Pistol

        Comment


          #5
          This is an excellent idea! I would love to see this in game

          Comment


            #6
            You know this isn't a bad idea.. Enforcer never really had a good alt fire anyway, but having a dispersion pistol secondary might be quite useful. And maybe I wouldn't hate Gooba's Enforcer concept so much then

            Comment


              #7
              Well thanks to a web error the stuff I was writing up for the topic got erased. X__x
              I guess I'll make this quick and dirty for now.

              I wanted to talk about the tracer round-obsession UT4 has right now and to talk about alternatives, possibly remove it from the enforcer but for now I'll just say that having such a weak weapon like the current Enforcer is basically useless and having them give away your location just makes it almost suicidal. Giving the Enforcer a more stealthy bullet type gives a little more reasoning to why the enforcer is so **** weak... If it can be stealthy and weak that makes more sense balance wise.

              Comment


                #8
                Originally posted by Wail View Post
                I am not sure how you manage to get 3 = 5.
                Just to clarify, each line in my post above is corresponding to one thing.
                Got it, I thought you were adding on more modes ontop of what I already discussed than I suggested. thus making 5.

                My experience with burst is that it sucks. To quote someone I played with. "The Enforcer burst fire is like the klobb"
                For people who don't get the reference it's a goldeneye weapon that misses more than it hits which is completely accurate to the current Enforcer.

                I think I'd be completely okay with getting rid of the burst fire entirely but the secondary gansta mode was always horribly inaccurate as well, at least it's reasonable why it's inaccurate when you hold it sideways. I think the burst fire is just left over from when UT3 tried to be super realistic and "military shooter in the future!" feeling. To that extent, if the modes overlap (fire faster) then I'd opt for the more over the top fun and silly gansta shooter style instead of super-realism-gritty shooter from UT3.
                Last edited by FirebornForm; 10-15-2014, 06:56 PM.

                Comment


                  #9
                  Next up I want to cover balance.

                  Enforcer
                  UT99 = 6 shot kill (classic) Roughly around 15-17 damage
                  15-30-45-60-75-90

                  UT99 = 4 shot kill (hardcore) 25 damage.
                  25-50-75-100

                  UT4 = 5 shot kill (hardcore) 20-22 damage the same as UT3's Enforcer.
                  20-40-60-80-100

                  Since alt fire is redundant... that means the only difference is the fire rate.
                  So you can kill people twice as fast with gansta mode if you are close to them.
                  In addition, you can kill people twice as fast with dual enforcers from a distance, or four times as fast with dual enforcer gansta mode again at closer range.

                  In comparison to the redundant UT3 burst mode you can rack up to 90 damage in a very short period of time IF you connect your shots. I think the problem with UT3's mode is that it's deceptive. It seems like it will work longer range but it sucks at long range, you also don't have much room for error once you start firing where as the alt fire gansta mode is more correctable and newb-friendly when you can keep the fire button down. Spraying is a common thing new players do before learning how to aim precisely and I think having the enforcer be noob friendly is very important if they're going to be dying and starting with it again and again.

                  Dispersion/Pulse UT99
                  I think taking the Dispersion Gun verbatim will never work, and thats why people always say it sucks. So I'm instead taking the old pulse rifle and retooling it for the Enforcer secondary, my best look at what will work for the Dispersion mode is the old Pulse rifle. It fits all of the bills, it's been tested in a UT setting and it's always been the slowest projectile. This fits nicely with DP being the slowest projectile. All people have to do is tweak the link gun primary, remake it to the pulse gun, color it blue and stick it on the enforcer as a secondary.

                  Of course the spam-ability of pulse is another thing to discuss but for now I'm only interested in the damage and the projectile speed.

                  UT99 = 5 shot kill (classic) 20 damage
                  UT99 = 4 shot kill (hardcore) 25 damage

                  Since we're building around hardcore balance, the DP secondary mode MUST be more than 20 damage of the Enforcer primary or no one would ever use it. This would help address people saying the enforcer is too **** weak if the secondary is a more powerful option. For the sake of easy punching in numbers we already know works, I'd say just try out using 25 damage for secondary dispersion mode for now as the bar minimum.

                  This way people get this.
                  Primary = Fast low damage (20)
                  Secondary = Slow high damage (25+)
                  Last edited by FirebornForm; 10-15-2014, 07:49 PM.

                  Comment


                    #10
                    Editing this thread, per some feedback from others I'm going to make the TL;DR section and move it to the very top of the OP. This way people can quickly get an idea on what I'm proposing and afterwords if they want to read a novel on analyzing the game mechanics they can continue reading instead of needing to scroll for days as a "Get to the point" feeling.

                    Comment


                      #11
                      PHASE THREE - Adding value to the enforcer and reducing redundancy with other weapons.

                      Enforcer bullet mode = No tracer, or very small and short. not the long string it is now.
                      It's far too easy to spot someone firing an Enforcer at you. This makes the weapon incredibly punishing to use, and not new player friendly. If they missed, they just gave away their position with a BIG streak much like the Stinger and Sniper. For the Sniper and the Minigun it makes more sense because they are pretty high power weapons but the Enforcer is anything but high-powered and we've got one of the weaker iterations of it in UT4 with 20 damage. Since it's not very powerful, it shouldn't share these traits with the other more powerful guns.

                      As an added bonus, and part of a weapon balance. Removing the LONG trails of the Enforcer bullets will let people miss without instantly punishing them for doing so, and let's them try to fire again. On the flip side, players who have strong aiming skills will be able to get "sneak attacks" in without basically suicide like what comes at firing at someone with a trail... A gun with no trace-able trail carries the benefits of letting players be stealthy. The Sniper originally had this FX but as we see already, it doesn't anymore. The sniper has much larger benefits and power over the Enforcer since it carries a higher risk reward with the trail. But the Enforcer is drastically more risk than reward when it has a trail. For a starter-weapon it should not punish the player for using it so severely.

                      Enforcer dispersion mode = Remove Epic's "Stopping Power" from Enforcer bullets against Impact Hammers only and add it to everything effected by the dispersion projectile.
                      This makes the gun have more strategic use and the player gets consistent results instead of a weird "Well stopping power only applies if someones charging at you with a hammer" rule. If they hit someone with the slowest projectile possible, it should carry some sort of reward. An extra damage is nice, but if you want to encourage them to use it more often, stopping power will show them immediate differences without them even needing to see your HP. This helps reinforce the notion that the secondary dispersion projectile is more powerful, as it's stopping people in their tracks.

                      How much stopping power, slowing power or stunning power can be configured and toyed with for testing the weapon to find the best balance from being ranging useless to overpowered. A happy medium should be met!
                      Last edited by FirebornForm; 10-16-2014, 09:14 PM.

                      Comment


                        #12
                        One more Edit for now. Wail, I like your proposed idea on how to enable faster fire gansta/burst mode, it's pretty much my feelings on the orginal UT99 Rocket special fire. I've pretty much applied this logic to all of the weapons I'm thinking about in the future.

                        LC = Primary fire
                        LC hold + RC tap = special version of primary fire

                        RC = secondary fire
                        RC hold + LC tap = special version of secondary fire.

                        Since enforcer faster is a special version of primary it fits.
                        And Link secondary pulse is a special version of secondary.
                        The secondary RC to rockets loading up LC helps this say this is a specialized rocket (primary) mode.

                        Not every single gun needs all 4 modes but it will help set some logic to the player that guns can get special functions if you hold and tap the other button.

                        Comment


                          #13
                          Originally posted by FirebornForm View Post
                          Not every single gun needs all 4 modes but it will help set some logic to the player that guns can get special functions if you hold and tap the other button.
                          Yep, that's a good point. Most of my ideas for improving weapons have been along these lines as we can add utility and versatility to weapons that have traditionally been lacking in some respects. Looking specifically at the BioRifle, LinkGun, and to a lesser extent the Minigun and Sniper.

                          Anyway I already created my prototype for what I suggested for the Enforcer. Link to discussion thread.

                          Not really set on any particular 'flavor' for the altfire but I'd like to see something like a grenade/explosive round or an energy burst. I'm not picky on the precise graphics but something with a little bit more single-shot punch than an Enforcer bullet, at the cost of being a projectile. The trick is figuring something that makes sense with the Enforcer weapon model.

                          Based on the historical way the Enforcer has fit into the arsenal, and how the current Enforcer model does not have a second barrel, I'd say some kind of explosive round might be better. The Enforcer has never really been a very energy-heavy weapon. We might be able to argue based on the model that it tips the alt-fire bullets with unstable Tarydium or plasma or something for explosive effect.
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                          Unreal Prime Weapons: Impact Hammer | Enforcer | BioRifle | Shock Rifle | Link Gun | Ripper | Minigun | Flak Cannon | Rocket Launcher | Sniper Rifle | Grenade Launcher | Dispersion Pistol

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                            #14
                            Looks like the Enforcer version of 2k's assault rifle. I'm not sure about how balanced that is because the assault rifle was weak because of the ability to use the grenade otherwise it might be too good. On the topic of too good, lol the current gansta mode is just OP in your prototype. No downside to using it other than ammo consumption, it definitely needs the crazy-recoil spread the gansta/burst mode has always had.

                            As far as the dispersion gun and enforcer. Dispersion is a weird energy in the Unreal universe. If you want to get picky it could easily be said that the dispersion mechanisms are already built into the barrel. Since it's energy based, it would conjure up the dispersion shot without needing a seperate barrel, it can share the same one. I was thinking on the other hand though, more like the enforcer has energy generating coils on the front grill. Since dispersion is a unique energy type, it can bend the rules on what we need to make it. Then you'd get to see a dispersion charge at the front of the barrel or around the barrel rather than inside of it.

                            I actually covered the subject of sharing energy/bullet properties to make the gun feel cooler and more "Unreal". (But then the forum/firefox crashed and I lost everything on that)
                            Just skip to 3:40 where he's loading up a super bright tracer, to me just coloring that blue would make it seem an awful like it's a dispersion charged bullet and a lot more visually interesting than what we've got.
                            Last edited by FirebornForm; 10-16-2014, 11:11 PM.

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                              #15
                              Originally posted by FirebornForm View Post
                              Looks like the Enforcer version of 2k's assault rifle. I'm not sure about how balanced that is because the assault rifle was weak because of the ability to use the grenade otherwise it might be too good. On the topic of too good, lol the current gansta mode is just OP in your prototype. No downside to using it other than ammo consumption, it definitely needs the crazy-recoil spread the gansta/burst mode has always had.
                              Don't take the lack of spread literally. The only reason it is like that is due to the fact that I implemented peripheral firemodes as a subclass of UTWeapon rather than in UTWeapon itself (since I have no idea if Epic will incorporate these changes, but I want to be able to iterate on ideas using this concept regardless of what they do otherwise). If UTWeap_Enforcer were subclassing my UTWeapon peripheral fire class, the spread would be in there (my prototype is just a quick and dirty blueprint I made in a few minutes).
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                              Unreal Prime Weapons: Impact Hammer | Enforcer | BioRifle | Shock Rifle | Link Gun | Ripper | Minigun | Flak Cannon | Rocket Launcher | Sniper Rifle | Grenade Launcher | Dispersion Pistol

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