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The [UNOFFICIAL] Bio Launcher Thoughts & Suggestions Thread

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    [PROTOTYPE] The [UNOFFICIAL] Bio Launcher Thoughts & Suggestions Thread

    I noticed there was no thread regarding the bio launcher. I'm not sure if the weapon is getting the attention it deserves. Let this thread serve as the place for constructive criticism / suggestions for the purpose of improving the bio launcher, and not just bashing it because it's not the bio rifle we all grew up with.

    ESL is mandating bio rifle be replaced with bio launcher

    Seeing as the bio launcher is replacing the bio rifle in the first ESL tournament, that essentially solidifies this gun as being worthy of discussion. Why aren't we practicing more with this weapon?

    What exactly is the bio launcher?

    The bio launcher primary fire launches bouncy grenade canisters that explode and leave behind a toxic gas cloud. Direct hit explosions are possible, and splash damage is also possible. The secondary fire mode is like the traditional full charge bio, except long strands of bio attach to nearby walls to create a web. In its current state, this web is very laggy, very random, and sometimes the web doesn't even get created for unknown reasons.

    What does the bio launcher aim to do?

    My belief is that the "bio rifle" is one of the most difficult, frustrating, and unpredictable weapons to use. My theory is that the bio launcher aims to make the gun more useful, more versatile, and good enough to stand on its own. I'd say that's an admirable goal.

    Is it more useful?

    After play testing several duels with it, I'd say yes, it absolutely is more useful. The main problem I'm experiencing right now is running out of ammo constantly when using the secondary fire. This is due to the weapon replacement mutator only replacing the weapon and not the ammo. Bio launcher currently requires different ammo. Running out of ammo is common. With that said, the primary fire hits hard, is fast, moderately difficult to land direct hits, but they do happen more than you'd think. The secondary fire is just like the original full charge, and as such, hits hard but takes away all of your ammo. I'm more prone to use the primary until the lack of ammo situation is resolved.

    Grenades bouncing off walls

    Grenades bounce off walls very quickly, and even if you move out of the way, there's a chance it will ricochet and hit you from behind, dealing a decent amount of damage. Eventually they will skid across the floor and explode into a toxic gas cloud. It's very effective and can be used on diagonal walls to land prediction shots. Very useful in my opinion.

    Gas Cloud

    I personally am a fan of the gas cloud. If you don't land a direct hit, there's still the opportunity to create a maze of gas cloud traps your opponents must navigate in order to avoid, therefore making your opponent more predictable. This makes the bio launcher a utility/trap setting weapon.

    Secondary Bio Web

    Currently laggy, and hard to hit. I haven't had much experience with it since a full charge exhausts ammo completely. Until there's an ammo replacement mutator that can be used in conjunction with the weapon replacement mutator, feedback on the secondary fire mode will be limited. I personally don't like the bio web since it's unpredictable. I prefer the primary.

    Mid Air Potential

    Biorifle historically had limited mid air potential because running around with a full charge put your opponents on edge, making them perform less risky moves. Now, the bio launcher primary launches very predictable gas grenades, that as a result will swat players out of the sky. The mid air potential of this gun just increased a ton. You're going to start seeing some awesome frags with this gun as a result.

    Rate of Fire

    The rate of fire on the primary fire mode needs to be reduced. Right now it feels like I can rapid fire the bio grenades, and it's a very scary / devastating weapon as is. Trust me on this, I played a few duels with nanner and oh god we wanted that weapon more than any other weapon due to its usefulness. The bio launcher may actually be a little OP due to the fast rate of fire. Toned down a bit and it should be good!

    Ammo Capacity

    10 bio grenades seems fine to me. 1 full charged secondary doesn't seem fine to me at all. If you pickup bio ammo, you'll have 20 grenades and 2 full charge secondary shots. That's wayyyy too much ammo for grenades, and way too little ammo for the secondary. Perhaps make a full charge require only 7-8 ammo... then make a bio launcher ammo pickup give you only 6-7 ammo. 16 grenades is going to be more than enough for most situations. The secondary fire mode suffers the most since using it depletes your ammo supply drastically. Something needs to be changed about this imo.

    Is this gun an innovation?

    Hell yeah it is. Don't even try to throw the wikipedia definition of innovation at me. The gun is more useful now than it ever has been before, and it'll be a hell of a lot of fun once it's balanced accordingly.


    Should the biorifle be left alone, and should the bio launcher become a completely different gun such as a grenade launcher?

    Personally, I think the bio rifle is in serious need of a makeover. It makes no difference to me whether the biorifle gets replaced with a bio launcher, or we simply turn the bio launcher into a grenade launcher that can complement the current weapon lineup. Either way works for me. The more weapons, the merrier. But assuming the bio rifle in its current state isn't a disaster is ignoring a serious problem. Nobody likes the biorifle (I'm exaggerating of course ), and the bio launcher (if people would simply give it a chance) aims to fix that!

    Final Thoughts

    The bio launcher is a very welcome change to the bio rifle, imo. It's a shame the IRC community isn't giving it a chance. Of COURSE the weapon is super problematic in its current state, compared to the other weapons. The other guns have had a long time to go through tweaks/revisions. The bio launcher will need some of those too before we can realistically address its inclusion. For the time being, these are just thoughts/opinions.


    Interested what the community thinks and also would maybe even like a dev response on this.

    -Neil (CaptainMigraine)
    Last edited by Neilz0r; 02-27-2016, 11:23 PM.
    Contact me: (Steam: Neillithan) (E-mail: neilvmoore@gmail.com)


    #2
    Originally posted by CaptainMigraine View Post
    The bio launcher is a very welcome change to the bio rifle, imo. It's a shame the IRC community isn't giving it a chance. Of COURSE the weapon is super problematic in its current state, compared to the other weapons. The other guns have had a long time to go through tweaks/revisions. The bio launcher will need some of those too before we can realistically address its inclusion. For the time being, these are just thoughts/opinions.
    At the moment I'm pretty happy with Unreal Prime weapon changes so I've been holding out for Wail's fixed bio. But I didn't know there was already a bio launcher out there. I'll have to check it out.

    Comment


      #3
      Pretty much agree that it's a fun weapon. We've been using it a lot in some TSD games. The bio web comes in handy in very narrow corridors, mitigating the random spread of it's web. It's a nice mechanic to block off people from using a certain route. Same with the grenades, although I think they're a little bit imbalanced at the moment, damage wise and of course collision-wise (because what's not in UT4 ).

      I prefer having some kind of random element to the primary bounce, so people won't abuse it to spam powerup spots or spawns or w/e. Just like it happened in ut99 (with the razor). I both dislike having random factors and spam, but in this scenario, I'd prefer having a small random factor, so it can't be consistently used in such a way.

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        #4
        bio rifle is as iconic to unreal tournament as every other weapon imo, it' shouldn't be replaced. i think most people who hate on it just don't know how to use it, it saved me tons of times in duels

        Comment


          #5
          Originally posted by CaptainMigraine View Post
          Nobody likes the biorifle, and the bio launcher (if people would simply give it a chance) aims to fix that!
          I do like the Bio rifle ! (The overall weapon, not the UT4 specifically). But it might indeed need some rework.
          Reading your idea it kind of remind me the Grenade launcher from UC2, it was more or less the same idea. Primary launch bouncy projectiles, enabling some trickshots, and second fired a proximity mine or a remote controlled explosive if your triggered primary with secondary, giving the more defensive use of the gun.

          I think the Bio rifle should keep the role of the weird alien things with green goo and strange firing, and use your idea as our more well know GL (with the UT design of course).

          Comment


            #6
            Right now it's basically a low risk, high reward weapon with too much ammo. 70 damage and some aoe for basically no positioning requirements, can easily spam armor points on ASDF, Erase and others. I think the concept is fine but the current damage output is insane. Definitely needs to be toned down. Not sure why ESL wants to include it before it's been balanced and tweaked.

            Comment


              #7
              Originally posted by Lemma
              I can't find the weapon anywhere at all. Can anyone provide a download link for the Bio Launcher here, please?
              You need to create a game and add the weapon replacement mutator. Configure it to replace the bio rifle with the bio launcher.
              Contact me: (Steam: Neillithan) (E-mail: neilvmoore@gmail.com)

              Comment


                #8


                https://forums.unrealtournament.com/...uck-in-the-air

                Comment


                  #9
                  I love idea. Maybe also appear Ripper and Lightning Gun.

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                    #10
                    The bio-launcher is a great idea. It's not so much about replacing the bio-rifle as it is about replacing it's rather useless/boring primary fire. With secondary charge more or less as it always was the new grenade primary should hopefully promote some interesting gameplay that was previously hidden away behind a rocket launcher mode rarely used by anyone. Love the addition of the gas-cloud, it fits the bio theme well and gives the weapon some interesting area denial capabilities not seen in other more "practical" splash weapons like the RL or the flak-nade

                    Comment


                      #11
                      Honestly I'm not happy with the Bio Launcher. The primary fire is too spammy, in addition to flak and rocket spam this can get very annoying, especially in public games. The secondary fire is also questionable. I mean do we really need a weapon which can block paths in a fast arena shooter? And besides that, you don't even have to hit the enemy with your shot, it's enough when you hit the wall near him and there's a good chance he'll get hit by the web and die.

                      I also think the Bio Rifle could need some kind of enhancement, but as I said I'm not totally happy with the concept of the Bio Launcher. I'm more for a improvement of the classic Bio Rifle primary fire and keeping the secondary fire as it is. Personally I would be good with the Bio Rifle still being a hate it or love it weapon in UT4.
                      inUnreal.de - german Unreal Tournament Fansite

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