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The Flame-Jump Gun

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  • replied
    Yes we need a flame thrower but make it start fires as the alt fire probably.. the jump is in the rocket launcer and hopefully the web in the bio rifle

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  • replied
    Originally posted by Andriushka View Post
    Created topic about flame gun changes https://forums.unrealtournament.com/...433#post106433
    Why a new thread in the same subforum? Do you want something entirely different?

    Originally posted by FPSYX View Post
    So, I worked on it a bit more, and changed the alt-fire. The idea is now that it behaves more like a rocket engine. Both main and alt are based on fuel expulsion, but nozzle-width/pressure changes depending on the type of fire mode you trigger.
    That way it might be more coherent, while retaining that mix of area damage / traversal tool I wanted to bring with that weapon idea.
    (The capsule ejection backward boost could still be a 3rd option, for instance if both left/right mouse button are pressed simultaneously.)

    I did a fairly quick prototyping of it :



    Possible uses :
    1) Vertical "take off"
    2) Arc movement
    3) Arc movement over large gaps
    4) "Bunny hopping"
    5) Horizontal, on the ground (in the video it gives about the same velocity as normal running; if you are running, your speed would be further increased)
    6) Avoid fall damage

    + 1 extra clip with infinite fuel... because it's kinda fun to use

    If you want to give it a try, here's the (really rough) prototype : FlameJumpV2.zip

    That being said, I'll leave it at that. If anyone wants to pick it up, please feel free to do so. And thanks to everybody for the input.
    IMHO the gun should work much like a jetpack in terms of acceleration, except for the obviously different direction of force. I don't quite like the way you can stop with an extremely short burst, yet you don't gain much upward speed when activating it for a longer duration.
    With this kind of utility functionality it's probably more comparable to the impact hammer than to other weapons. I mean, the idea is good, but the way the weapon works may make it difficult to integrate into the general game flow.

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  • replied
    Created topic about flame gun changes https://forums.unrealtournament.com/...433#post106433

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  • replied
    It seems to have so many utilities now that it would be weird to not make it a standard starting tool for all players, because whoever gets the flame gun gets a giant movement advantage. I think something like that would be more appropriate as a power-up rather than a weapon function.

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  • replied
    So, I worked on it a bit more, and changed the alt-fire. The idea is now that it behaves more like a rocket engine. Both main and alt are based on fuel expulsion, but nozzle-width/pressure changes depending on the type of fire mode you trigger.
    That way it might be more coherent, while retaining that mix of area damage / traversal tool I wanted to bring with that weapon idea.
    (The capsule ejection backward boost could still be a 3rd option, for instance if both left/right mouse button are pressed simultaneously.)

    I did a fairly quick prototyping of it :



    Possible uses :
    1) Vertical "take off"
    2) Arc movement
    3) Arc movement over large gaps
    4) "Bunny hopping"
    5) Horizontal, on the ground (in the video it gives about the same velocity as normal running; if you are running, your speed would be further increased)
    6) Avoid fall damage

    + 1 extra clip with infinite fuel... because it's kinda fun to use

    If you want to give it a try, here's the (really rough) prototype : FlameJumpV2.zip

    That being said, I'll leave it at that. If anyone wants to pick it up, please feel free to do so. And thanks to everybody for the input.
    Last edited by FPSYX; 10-27-2014, 05:07 PM.

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  • replied
    If you do continue with this, adding some of the turbulence based particle effects (the ones that look like physx but are built into the engine) to the fire could potentially look great, if done subtly it could make it look less like floating 2d planes and more like dynamic fire

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  • replied
    Originally posted by RushPL View Post
    from the video it looks like the primary fire is really slow and hence not very useful in a fast paced game
    looks like a defensive weapon. could be interpreted as a smokegun alt-fire for impact hammer

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  • replied
    You might want to work on the flame effects a bit. Gas or short-range liquid-based flames have a short lifespan, so in order to achieve range, they must travel fast. Also they don't maintain a fixed size, but constantly grow while getting weaker. Larger flamethrowers pump the burning liquid with much more pressure and in larger quantities, so it doesn't burn up all at once, but the burning liquid can travel quite a distance before being used up. In that case, the liquid describes an arc, because it's gravity-affected, while the flames surround the stream of liquid and move upward.

    Here's a video of a flame tank I created for UT2004. Notice how the flames appear much more dynamic simply because the particles travel much faster. You can probably consider it a pair of "spray-based" flames. (Originally I wanted a liquid-based flames look, but that turned out almost impossible to look right.)


    And fore reference, here's a real flamethrower in action:

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  • replied
    Being spammy is not the problem (UT99 being spammy actually contributed to it being fun), from the video it looks like the primary fire is really slow and hence not very useful in a fast paced game - I could be wrong though. The secondary fire+jump looks fun and useful.

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  • replied
    GreatEmerald, thank you again for the video, and apologies for having taken so much time to answer.

    The napalm spray / flamethrower combination is indeed perfectly logical, and clearly very useful as a tactical tool.

    However, it seems to me that UT weapons are at their most interesting when the main and alt fire have a maximum of contrast in function. That's why the shock rifle is one of the most iconic and interesting UT weapons, I think. (And of course combining both fire modes to get a 3rd result is the cherry on top!)

    So that's why I find that combination of area damage / traversal tool in the same weapon more interesting than a fairly plain flamethrower or grenade launcher. (Not saying that those UII are uninspired - they clearly are quite original, esp. the grenade launcher - but I feel they lack this contrast of function that interests me.)


    Originally posted by GreatEmerald View Post
    Right, here you go:



    It might be a bit hard to get what happened with the Mukhoggs at the end there, but they seemingly vanished due to actually getting gibbed. The napalm does so much damage that it chars things to dust

    Worth mentioning is that in Unreal II XMP they changed the alt fire a bit. There if an enemy tries crossing the napalm, it automatically ignites. Also, IIRC the individual napalm pools in XMP don't chain-ignite as quickly as they do in Unreal II.

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  • replied
    I like the mix of flame thrower and jump propulsion balls. For some, this combination might seem odd but still, UT was different from other arena shooters because of its unconventionality. I think that this weapon is very cool, the concept is awesome, so you should continue working on it. This is a new UT, so new unconventional weapons would be a mouth of fresh air.
    Last edited by mahri726; 08-03-2014, 03:56 PM.

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  • replied
    Sorry about the lack of updates, I've been swamped by work. And it might still be a while before I might be able to go back to that weapon, so I've decided to share it as it is. The functionality as player should be working as intended, but as another player watching you won't see the "cosmetic" aspect behave as it should.

    FlameJump.zip

    Inside the FlameJump and FlameJump_BurningFuel BPs, there are green debug boxes which you can use to make testing easier.

    Also, as this idea for a weapon had quite a lukewarm reception, I'll add a poll to the thread to help me decide whether or not it's worth continuing to work on it or move on to something else once I have some free time again.
    Last edited by FPSYX; 10-27-2014, 05:06 PM.

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  • replied
    For jump weapon i think impact hammer would be better.

    Primary fire of flamethrower is just spammy weapon currently.

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  • replied
    Hey, sorry about the delay answering. Thanks a bunch for the video, I've watched it but haven't yet had the time to think about it. I'll let you know once I've been able to do so.

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  • replied
    Right, here you go:



    It might be a bit hard to get what happened with the Mukhoggs at the end there, but they seemingly vanished due to actually getting gibbed. The napalm does so much damage that it chars things to dust

    Worth mentioning is that in Unreal II XMP they changed the alt fire a bit. There if an enemy tries crossing the napalm, it automatically ignites. Also, IIRC the individual napalm pools in XMP don't chain-ignite as quickly as they do in Unreal II.

    Leave a comment:

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