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    Originally posted by MoxNix View Post
    Naturally, just wanted to be sure there aren't any major issues with online play before I do so.

    Hmm... So where's the download for the editor? All I see is a pak and I can't open that in the editor.
    You know what, I didn't even think about that. I'll look at it this evening.
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    Unreal Prime Weapons: Impact Hammer | Enforcer | BioRifle | Shock Rifle | Link Gun | Ripper | Minigun | Flak Cannon | Rocket Launcher | Sniper Rifle | Grenade Launcher | Dispersion Pistol

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      Updated Ripper

      Summary: Added ammo pickups, tweaked lifespan of blades (reduce lifespan by 0.5s per bounce), headshots should no longer be possible after 2 bounces, guidance on altfire should be mildly improved.

      Download for Map Authors




      Also wanted to post this image here to lay the foundation for how the Ripper should replace the Avril.

      This Image Was Automatically Resized by using the Screenshot Tag.  Click to view the full version
      Attached Files
      Join Project: Open Tournament: OpenTournamentGame.com | Project Trello | Discord | YouTube

      Subscribe to /r/UnrealSeries - The subreddit for free & uncensored discussion of Unreal series games!

      Unreal Prime Weapons: Impact Hammer | Enforcer | BioRifle | Shock Rifle | Link Gun | Ripper | Minigun | Flak Cannon | Rocket Launcher | Sniper Rifle | Grenade Launcher | Dispersion Pistol

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        Wail amazing job. I especially love the purple tint on the blade. very nice touch!

        Comment


          Originally posted by Wail View Post
          Updated Ripper

          Summary: Added ammo pickups, tweaked lifespan of blades (reduce lifespan by 0.5s per bounce), headshots should no longer be possible after 2 bounces, guidance on altfire should be mildly improved.

          Download for Map Authors




          Also wanted to post this image here to lay the foundation for how the Ripper should replace the Avril.

          This Image Was Automatically Resized by using the Screenshot Tag.  Click to view the full version
          This Image Was Automatically Resized by using the Screenshot Tag.  Click to view the full version

          I... I cant express how much I want this. I NEED THIS IN MY VEINS.

          I've always hated the Avril. It represented EVERYTHING wrong with UT's take on vehicular gameplay. it was tacked-on, one-dimensional, uninspired and useless outside of vehicle gametypes. This... This fixes ALL OF THAT.

          Comment


            Yea it's a potential fix for vehicle modes although it would still need to be tested from gameplay point of view, taking out avril also meant compromising your fragging ability for a little while and if you now have a "decent" weapon in your hand to also counter people meanwhile having out Ripper to take out some vehicle may also impact the gameplay a bit. Should also be noted, Avril had long reloading which probably wouldn't work if it's also meant to be useful for other gametypes.

            So I'm not that convinced that The Ripper would be able to replace Avril though.

            Comment


              Originally posted by Wail View Post
              Updated Ripper

              Summary: Added ammo pickups, tweaked lifespan of blades (reduce lifespan by 0.5s per bounce), headshots should no longer be possible after 2 bounces, guidance on altfire should be mildly improved.

              Download for Map Authors
              Awesome, thank you!

              Just added it to a map of mine, Pak'ing now, will test soon and assuming it works probably release a new version of the map in a few hours.

              Does this need to be put in a specific location or added/loaded/configured w/e a certain way to work? When attempting to pak I get an unresolved compiler error on the weapon blueprint.
              Last edited by MoxNix; 04-16-2015, 02:36 AM.

              Comment


                Originally posted by RPGWiZ4RD View Post
                Yea it's a potential fix for vehicle modes although it would still need to be tested from gameplay point of view, taking out avril also meant compromising your fragging ability for a little while and if you now have a "decent" weapon in your hand to also counter people meanwhile having out Ripper to take out some vehicle may also impact the gameplay a bit. Should also be noted, Avril had long reloading which probably wouldn't work if it's also meant to be useful for other gametypes.

                So I'm not that convinced that The Ripper would be able to replace Avril though.
                But that is the exact reason the Avril represented EVERYTHING wrong with vehicular gameplay in Unreal. It was so separated, so distanced from everything else in Unreal. Players had to use a big, slow, single-purpose gun to balance them, which means that players were either fighting vehicles, or fighting players on feet, and the idea that you could do both at once is seemingly preposterous (just look at your reaction). Vehicle gameplay needs to blend into UT as if it and on-foot gameplay were forged from the same mill. Why should vehicles require a special gun to combat? Why not have the avril function integrated into a weapon?

                Comment


                  Originally posted by KazeoHin-TechAE View Post
                  Why not have the avril function integrated into a weapon?
                  Exactly the last part of the concept image. Different damage to vehicles.
                  ] Map Scaler Tool | Betrayal for UT4 | No Spawn Protection | No Pickup Timer | BioLauncher (revived) | ForcePickupSpawn | Map cosmetics::P | Safe Spawn::P | Why numbers for Health/Armor suck!::ANALYSIS/CONCEPT
                  ] UT3 Addons: NoMoreDemoGuy | PickupRespawnTweak | Mutate Spec | MutePawnSounds | NoPlayerBeacon | Epic FTW | Epic FOCK | TripodSound (... and many more)

                  Comment


                    It's okay, you have your opinion, I have mine. I'm also basing on UT3's Avril only which had clearly better configured Avril than UT2k4 with a lot faster projectile and felt more satisfying to use regarding how the projectile travelled.

                    Many vehicles it was already more effective to destroy by normal weapons, it was either the fast paced hovering vehicles or the airborne ones which required Avril.

                    But I liked that you had to commit to either destroying a vehicle and taking into account enemy players so it's more of a situational decision.

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by RPGWiZ4RD View Post
                      It's okay, you have your opinion, I have mine. I'm also basing on UT3's Avril only which had clearly better configured Avril than UT2k4 with a lot faster projectile and felt more satisfying to use regarding how the projectile travelled.

                      Many vehicles it was already more effective to destroy by normal weapons, it was either the fast paced hovering vehicles or the airborne ones which required Avril.

                      But I liked that you had to commit to either destroying a vehicle and taking into account enemy players so it's more of a situational decision.
                      Hey, to each their own, agree to disagree. Let us instead congratulate Wail on an awesome shoutout in the stream! Keep up the good work, dude.

                      Comment


                        Originally posted by MoxNix View Post
                        Awesome, thank you!

                        Just added it to a map of mine, Pak'ing now, will test soon and assuming it works probably release a new version of the map in a few hours.

                        Does this need to be put in a specific location or added/loaded/configured w/e a certain way to work? When attempting to pak I get an unresolved compiler error on the weapon blueprint.

                        Hey Mox, I'm not sure! It's new ground to me so I'm not sure what's going on. I'll see if I can try to get in touch with raxxy or Flikswitch or someone else who might have some experience with this side of things. Today is a super busy day for me though so I may not be able to get back to you until tomorrow.
                        Join Project: Open Tournament: OpenTournamentGame.com | Project Trello | Discord | YouTube

                        Subscribe to /r/UnrealSeries - The subreddit for free & uncensored discussion of Unreal series games!

                        Unreal Prime Weapons: Impact Hammer | Enforcer | BioRifle | Shock Rifle | Link Gun | Ripper | Minigun | Flak Cannon | Rocket Launcher | Sniper Rifle | Grenade Launcher | Dispersion Pistol

                        Comment


                          Originally posted by KazeoHin-TechAE View Post
                          But that is the exact reason the Avril represented EVERYTHING wrong with vehicular gameplay in Unreal. It was so separated, so distanced from everything else in Unreal. Players had to use a big, slow, single-purpose gun to balance them, which means that players were either fighting vehicles, or fighting players on feet, and the idea that you could do both at once is seemingly preposterous (just look at your reaction). Vehicle gameplay needs to blend into UT as if it and on-foot gameplay were forged from the same mill. Why should vehicles require a special gun to combat? Why not have the avril function integrated into a weapon?
                          As someone who has played LOADS of Onslaught (four-digit hours ), I have to disagree. If you managed to get somewhat stocked on weapons, the AVRiL was more of a fun addition, if anything (especially due to the very low ROF). Quick list of more suited anti-vehicle weapon choices:

                          • airborne: Shock primary (lots of knockback on Raptors and Cicadas); homing rockets; other vehicles (Goliath!)
                          • Manta: Shock secondary; loaded rockets; LG (headshotting driver); primary Flak up close
                          • Goliath: if in a really good camp spot, tanks were very hard to take out -> best to flank, jump on top and pump a couple of Flak primaries into it; otherwise, anything hitscan worked as good as good as the AVRiL
                          • ... the list does go on (mostly based on 2k4 obviously, though I played Warfare for some months as well)


                          The only fun kills you got with the AVRiL would be to shoot your rocket up in the sky, let it gain speed and then lock onto an unsuspecting target which would ideally be blasted one second later. Apart from that, many other weapons were quicker and more reliable. Also you would get a loud and clear warning when being locked on, so you usually had plenty of time to exit your vehicle and not be killed. "Everything wrong with vehicular gametypes"? Sorry, that just triggered me.


                          (Edit: I'm in the Ripper thread, wat. Sorry! However, I do follow this thread and like the current ideas of giving the Ripper some anti-vehicle bonuses)
                          Last edited by Le0_; 04-16-2015, 07:01 AM.

                          Comment


                            Originally posted by KazeoHin-TechAE View Post
                            This Image Was Automatically Resized by using the Screenshot Tag.  Click to view the full version

                            I... I cant express how much I want this. I NEED THIS IN MY VEINS.

                            I've always hated the Avril. It represented EVERYTHING wrong with UT's take on vehicular gameplay. it was tacked-on, one-dimensional, uninspired and useless outside of vehicle gametypes. This... This fixes ALL OF THAT.

                            Haha. Glad you like the idea Kazeo! I'm really passionate about this one too. I've been sitting on this idea for months just because I haven't had time to get this thing in a state where this idea is easily presentable.

                            The best part to me is it solves two problems with one stone:

                            1. The Avril being this spandrel of a weapon that has no place in the arsenal except as a one-dimensional vehicle counter.
                            2. The questionable utility of a weapon like the Ripper in big open maps.

                            It just makes sense.

                            To me this sort of integration is as important as allowing the Link Gun to repair vehicles and nodes. Somewhere along the line in development someone said, "Why should I ever use the Link Gun in <vehicle game mode>? It doesn't do anything the Minigun altfire or the Rocket Launcher can't do." Then along came the idea of linking up on vehicles and BAM. Now the Link Gun is absolutely essential equipment in ONS/War because of this important functionality, and it is an integral part of the flavor of Unreal Tournament style vehicular gameplay.

                            That is exactly how I see the Ripper fitting in to the arsenal if we're able to be open to the idea that the Avril isn't necessary.
                            The idea here is to try and achieve a better and more seamless integration of foot - vehicle combat.*


                            * I have played several thousand hours of ONS & War combined so I completely understand the mentality of being conservative with something that you already like. But in this case I think if people actually were able to play with the Ripper replacing the Avril, they would just never want the Avril back at all.
                            Join Project: Open Tournament: OpenTournamentGame.com | Project Trello | Discord | YouTube

                            Subscribe to /r/UnrealSeries - The subreddit for free & uncensored discussion of Unreal series games!

                            Unreal Prime Weapons: Impact Hammer | Enforcer | BioRifle | Shock Rifle | Link Gun | Ripper | Minigun | Flak Cannon | Rocket Launcher | Sniper Rifle | Grenade Launcher | Dispersion Pistol

                            Comment


                              @Wail.

                              Why not keep the guiding to the Avril which would improve the Avril killing foot players? The Ripper alternate is kept as it was (exploding discs), and the discs might get momentum applied (which would curving discs like in Wanted). It would be totally inconsitent to have ripper alternate discs dealing damage to vehicle only if guided, otherwise the discs would be too op against vehicles. Reducing the fire rate of the ripper's alternate, would be totally nerfing the weapon down.
                              ] Map Scaler Tool | Betrayal for UT4 | No Spawn Protection | No Pickup Timer | BioLauncher (revived) | ForcePickupSpawn | Map cosmetics::P | Safe Spawn::P | Why numbers for Health/Armor suck!::ANALYSIS/CONCEPT
                              ] UT3 Addons: NoMoreDemoGuy | PickupRespawnTweak | Mutate Spec | MutePawnSounds | NoPlayerBeacon | Epic FTW | Epic FOCK | TripodSound (... and many more)

                              Comment


                                Originally posted by RPGWiZ4RD View Post
                                It's okay, you have your opinion, I have mine. I'm also basing on UT3's Avril only which had clearly better configured Avril than UT2k4 with a lot faster projectile and felt more satisfying to use regarding how the projectile travelled.

                                Many vehicles it was already more effective to destroy by normal weapons, it was either the fast paced hovering vehicles or the airborne ones which required Avril.

                                But I liked that you had to commit to either destroying a vehicle and taking into account enemy players so it's more of a situational decision.
                                I much preferred 2k4's Avril, because the projectile started slower (giving the vehicle driver a chance) and could occasionally be duped by a skilled manta pilot slamming to the ground, or made to fly into a wall (due to its predictive behaviour). It could also be outrun if you were far enough away and got your manta/raptor legging it at top speed. UT3 avril was far too effective imo, instant death. If I were to change the 2k4 avril, It would be to make the missile pop out the barrel then ignite (as it would look cool, and explain the slower rocket) and just make sure it was rarer in vehicle maps as it could get quite spammy. Perhaps a tiny bit faster initial speed on the missile.

                                Sorry that was off topic but it leads on to what I wanted to say - I don't think the ripper should replace the Avril. I think its OK the ripper secondary homing is good against vehicles, as I imagine the primary would be fairly low damaging and hard to hit vehicles with. Also remember the Avril lock on is a deterrant, missile or none!

                                I also want to add, mega congrats to Wail and so glad this weapon is returning with these firing modes, it looks brilliant! I really think the secondary should be homing as its a unique weapon feature we've not seen yet and could be loads of fun.
                                UT4: CTF-Defiance, CTF-Melt.
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                                "It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." -Aristotle

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