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What would make people play arena FPS games again. Thoughts from non arenafps players

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    Just youtube search "evolution of halo." There's a 13 minute and change vid narrated by the Bungie guys of a lot of the original assets of halo, many of which didn't "make the cut." My Favorite quote from the vid, and one of the Bungie guys is "Halo used to be cool" in reference to before it was released.

    Originally posted by Artaneius View Post
    No, so you can better understand that in the entertainment business what pleases the majority is what goes.
    No. I'm not apart of the majority. I want choice in the market, not homogenized watered down, major market bs. I'm only following this project, because that's what it feels like it's out to be. It's free, it's running on a collective (socialized) development strategy, and this seems like the only way to make a full detail, next gen game of this nature, like this because there is no major market for it, so as not to have to succumb to major market demands.

    Not every game should be major market.
    Originally posted by Mysterial
    An instant hit, accurate, instant kill weapon is overpowered. There's no skill ceiling. It's limited only by the shooter's accuracy. It also severely impairs the defensive side of the game - ignoring ping, it is nearly irrelevant what your opponent does - click the right pixel and you win. Even non-instant kill instant hit weapons are often problematic - the Shock Rifle example is obvious before even getting to other games.

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      Originally posted by heartlessphil View Post
      I think we are all just too old to enjoy arena fps like we used to when we were young haha! And the new generation aren't too interested in the genre. I still love to watch stuff like defrag where the skill needed is insane! But playing quakelive/defrag bores me REALLY quick. Back in 2000 arena shooters are pretty all what we had... Biggest games... we're arena shooters.
      Ive been saying stuff like this since I joined the forum, this thread just mirrors all those conversations and the fact we are still having them at this point worries me. I really want to get in there and start working with the community to make bigger changes to UT since Epic seem unwilling to work closely enough to tackle larger community based tasks. We can all spam up a forum like this all we like but if this thread goes the same way it'll be a year and how ever many months later and it'll still be the same UT game.


      If we are going to do something about it people we need to kick Epic in the butt and they seem to have to be shown something works, so instead of just ******* in the wind why not come together to create a solution?
      Upon release, Unreal Tournament 2004 was met with widespread critical acclaim. Several critics praised the unique, fast-paced, fun and challenging nature of the game as its main selling points, while fans touted the post-release support and extensive modding capabilities.

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        Sorry for the late reply.


        Originally posted by phantaci View Post
        Not sure about that, we had KBM support on ps3 (UT3).
        I remember that, but never played it.
        Originally posted by phantaci View Post
        KBM has a learning curve if you aren't used to it. I wanted to quit so many times. It's demoralizing being good with a controller and then coming to PC and having to relearn everything.
        I remember reading a post about someone who was a top player in Titanfall IIRC thinking that he could start playing competitively on PC and then realizing how much of a skill gap difference there was.
        Originally posted by phantaci View Post
        Right now about 5 players from the console community now play UT4. Myself being one of them.
        I'd be interested in knowing who these people are. I'm developing a cross platform FPS game and would like feedback on people going from console to PC. PM me if you and / or the other players are interested.
        Originally posted by phantaci View Post
        That being said I do not see UT4 on console working.
        It doesn't have to work in the traditional sense. It just has to be there. With the potential for Modding, it just needs to be there as a platform.
        This game will be around longer than the current generation of consoles, so this will help bring more people to PC.
        Originally posted by phantaci View Post
        Not sure how they would implement slide or crouching. On console we couldn't crouch with a controller, (not enough buttons).
        Not sure if you are XBOX or PS4, but if Xbox grab your controller and plug it into your PC.

        Crouch default bind is left stick click button and bind Single Tap Dodge to LB.
        I've used this for playing some instagib matches just mix it up a bit.

        There is a bug that I've reported: [BUG] Controller - RT, LT, LB & RB retain default binds


        As a point of reference going from PC to Console is hard too!

        When I had a break from UT4 in 2014, I played Destiny on PS3 and PS4.

        I sucked hard at using a controller!


        I've always had trouble with FPS on console as I've used KB/mouse for a really long time.

        My brain would invert the controls momentarily when I tried to aim and then would switch it back......

        I got a XIM which allowed me to play KB/mouse and I would do really well in matches, but the device wouldn't support my high sensitivity requirement and lag out.

        With crossplay between PS3 and PS4 not being supported and no upgrade path for physical purchase copies I stopped playing Destiny.

        Originally posted by phantaci View Post
        I always tell people epic should just make another Unreal Championship and let UC be for console and UT for pc.
        This was discussed in another thread which I cannot recall the name of now.

        Basically, as UE4 allows for easy deployment across multiple platforms, it would be "easier" from a development and maintenance point of view to have a single product: UT4 and just deploy onto multiple platforms.

        I think it'd be great on multiple platforms as it might bring more people into the PC space.

        Also, it allows for a unified marketing strategy instead of having to market two separate products.

        Originally posted by phantaci View Post
        And to see how we managed: you can just watch these videos lol:
        Watched a few, not too shabby at all.
        Another crazy idea brought to you by richardboegli ;P

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          Sorry for the late reply.

          Originally posted by HenrikRyosa View Post
          Heh, brings back memories of my Cross-platform petition for UT3. The SQL of the signees is dead now so I won't bother linking to the page but here's what I wrote all dem years ago (nearly 10!)
          That would have been good to see

          Originally posted by HenrikRyosa View Post
          So far there's no real reason that I can see to assume there would ever be cross platform for UT4. Why would there be, and how would it work exactly when they already have 3 platforms to support with a skeleton team, and new builds of the game will be coming out on a regular basis for probably a couple of years yet?
          It doesn't have to work in the traditional sense. It just has to be there. With the potential for Modding, it just needs to be there as a platform.
          This game will be around longer than the current generation of consoles, so this will help bring more people to PC.

          Originally posted by HenrikRyosa View Post
          I loved the idea of it for UT3 because the community was small with no hope of change of that whereas our current phase of development and exposure is not even comparable. Second, we had the gametypes already that would have attracted console players (ie vehicular). Right now I just don't see the same appeal. Even the camping style play I mentioned, with snipers, would work far better for console than what we have now. Larger models, slower shots or not... all I see there is them trying to find the right balance of "feel" for most people and they finally recognized that it was off, people called out player model size repeatedly for years.
          Originally posted by HenrikRyosa View Post
          Not that it wouldn't be fun to see an experiment like that, but don't get your hopes up.
          I got fed up waiting for studios to realise and seize the potential of having a cross-platform and crossplay FPS game, so I started making one myself.

          I did the first prototype for the Unreal Engine #UE4JAM Gamejam in Feb 2016 as the theme "One Hit Wonder" lined up with what I had in mind.... POINT CLICK ILL - Sneeze your way to victory is a family friendly laser tag / "instagib" style crossplatform and crossplay game featuring Sam Smile, where each sneeze makes a player sick.
          Fly as a Sam Smile floating head around and sneeze on your opponents to win.
          Highest sick count wins.

          I submitted a bare bones prototype. It is a WIP and still has A LOT left to do. Movement is FAR from what I wanted, but I want to make sure I have my build chain setup correctly for all the platforms I am targeting before I spend any additional time in development. See Allar's Twitch stream video play through
          Another crazy idea brought to you by richardboegli ;P

          Comment


            how does this mention thing work? both with @ as in [MENTION=259874]richardboegli[/MENTION] or if we're quoted?

            UT4 modding discussion: irc.globalgamers.net #UTModders
            Contrib Digest | UT2341 - Henrik's UT4 Dev Blog | Twitter

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              Originally posted by HenrikRyosa View Post
              how does this mention thing work? both with @ as in @richardboegli or if we're quoted?
              Both @ AND if we are quoted.

              I'm loving it!
              Another crazy idea brought to you by richardboegli ;P

              Comment


                Originally posted by HenrikRyosa View Post
                how does this mention thing work? both with @ as in @richardboegli or if we're quoted?
                Originally posted by richardboegli View Post
                Both @ AND if we are quoted.

                I'm loving it!
                [MENTION=6256]HenrikRyosa[/MENTION] [OFFICIAL] Advanced User Tagging
                Another crazy idea brought to you by richardboegli ;P

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                  Yeah it's nice. Much less time wasted hunting.

                  UT4 modding discussion: irc.globalgamers.net #UTModders
                  Contrib Digest | UT2341 - Henrik's UT4 Dev Blog | Twitter

                  Comment


                    For me, what would me perfect, is no level cap, a LOT of unlocks (cosmetics only) and melee. Every fps i played before that had this made it so much better.
                    Contact me here
                    http://steamcommunity.com/id/E621415270717/

                    Comment


                      Originally posted by BBQ_Boysnuff View Post
                      For me, what would me perfect, is no level cap, a LOT of unlocks (cosmetics only) and melee. Every fps i played before that had this made it so much better.
                      Agreed. After playing Destiny, the level cap was really annoying and then trying to play UT4 and not having an always available Melee annoyed me for a while
                      Another crazy idea brought to you by richardboegli ;P

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                        Originally posted by 3Dmatic View Post
                        Unfortunately, what UT is about is completely up to Epic Games and can change whenever they see fit.

                        Just look at how Mario and Zelda changed over the years...
                        Franchises are great aren't they
                        Another crazy idea brought to you by richardboegli ;P

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                          Originally posted by MonsOlympus View Post
                          If we are going to do something about it people we need to kick Epic in the butt and they seem to have to be shown something works, so instead of just ******* in the wind why not come together to create a solution?
                          This ^^

                          Working prototypes to show the concept.

                          Whether Epic decides Go / No Go, is really irrelevant in the end. As long as they provide us the platform we can choose what we want to build and as a community choose what we want to play.
                          Another crazy idea brought to you by richardboegli ;P

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                            Originally posted by HenrikRyosa View Post
                            Yeah it's nice. Much less time wasted hunting.
                            Only issue is when people don't quote my full name, just use richard, cause boegli is hard to spell

                            What we really need to find is an inline autocomplete tool for VBulletin posts....that'd rock
                            Another crazy idea brought to you by richardboegli ;P

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                              Originally posted by -AEnubis- View Post
                              Just youtube search "evolution of halo." There's a 13 minute and change vid narrated by the Bungie guys of a lot of the original assets of halo, many of which didn't "make the cut." My Favorite quote from the vid, and one of the Bungie guys is "Halo used to be cool" in reference to before it was released.
                              Originally posted by Barktooth View Post
                              Ah, I'm not sure which Halo I've played.. We had a LAN party with it at school lol, and it felt slow as molasses. Probably was the ported console version, then.
                              Originally posted by Dementiurge View Post
                              I think richard is talking about the version of Halo that was in development before Microsoft bought Bungie.
                              The released version of Halo has always been slow, with high jump height. This made sense in Halo:CE, where the game was set on a space station, but Halo 2 was set on Earth and all Bungie changed was the weapons.
                              [MENTION=44586]aeN[/MENTION]ubis nailed it. I was looking for something like this:

                              Another crazy idea brought to you by richardboegli ;P

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                                What keeps holding Halo back from greatness?
                                One of the main features that holds Halo back is the Energy Shield that players need to break down. It forces players to use in the same linear fashion, over and over again, the same methods.
                                - Shoot until the shield breaks down, then melee or headshot.
                                - Melee to break shield, then melee or headshot.
                                - Grenade to destroy the shield, then melee or headshot.

                                It becomes somewhat quickly redundant. If Halo had instead a Health System similar to Quake and UT it would be much better and it would encourage more creativity. And then the grenades in Halo, are also holding it back. Grenades could be so much more, they could be literally like the abilities in Diablo. An abstract layer of gameplay that allows players to perform different attacks. Razor discs spinning around the player. A gadget that creates a shockwave hitting others around, maybe even forcing some players to jump, etc.

                                The melee in Halo adds an extra amount of depth to combat, but what holds Halo back is the lunging mechanic and the lack of a block button that makes face to face encounters a big mess; it's random.

                                Unreal 1998, a game that is still ahead of its time
                                That said, let's now go back to the original Unreal 1998 game. What did it feature?
                                - Guns
                                - Items such as flares, etc.

                                Other than a missing melee button, that template was actually quite close to Halo. Let's change the items for actual gadgets that can be used in combat, let's say 3 quick actions. And let's add that melee to the mix, a block button and also a grab button and suddenly you get something that is quite solid. You can shoot at monsters, combine your weapon fire modes by switching from one weapon to another, use your items in combat to gain time, push back a guy, AoE on another and with the new melee mechanics... block melee attacks, maybe even throwable weapon (knives, hatchets, etc.) thrown by Skaarjs, perform a perfect block to deflect one that goes right through the head of another monsters, shoot a dude in the legs, he drops to his knees, but he is a bit special as there is a behavior that causes that guy to explode, but he is at the wrong place, but you can grab him and throw him into a mob of monsters.

                                Wouldn't that make Invasion, Unreal 3 (singleplayer) and even UT a hell lot more exciting than it is now? [MENTION=1253]Steven Polge[/MENTION] [MENTION=4096]Entropy[/MENTION] [MENTION=259874]richardboegli[/MENTION] [MENTION=891]MonsOlympus[/MENTION]

                                Melee
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                                Block
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                                Grapple
                                This Image Was Automatically Resized by using the Screenshot Tag.  Click to view the full version This Image Was Automatically Resized by using the Screenshot Tag.  Click to view the full version

                                Combat items
                                This Image Was Automatically Resized by using the Screenshot Tag.  Click to view the full version This Image Was Automatically Resized by using the Screenshot Tag.  Click to view the full version This Image Was Automatically Resized by using the Screenshot Tag.  Click to view the full version This Image Was Automatically Resized by using the Screenshot Tag.  Click to view the full version This Image Was Automatically Resized by using the Screenshot Tag.  Click to view the full versionThis Image Was Automatically Resized by using the Screenshot Tag.  Click to view the full version
                                Last edited by 3Dmatic; 02-27-2016, 07:10 PM.

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