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Why does this game keep getting horribly worse with every update?

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  • Why does this game keep getting horribly worse with every update?

    Its like the game keeps going back and back. instead of moving forward. I'm not sure what are the developers thinking. but I really doubt they have any clue of what they are doing. Was this game handed off to Epic's Interns for them to experiment with?
    Looks like they didn't even play the original UTs. Why was hidden weapon taken off? Why is the movement after dodgeing crapped on? who comes up with this ideas? Not the community. that's for sure.

    No wonder, none of my UT hardcore friends want to play this game anymore. It's sad. Seriously everyone quit. I still had hope for this game and they call me dumb for still playing it. Im now learning the hard truth, that they are correct. This game will never amount to anything because the people in charge havent got a clue of what they are doing. I think they deliberately are trying to make it worse so people hate it. I see no other explanation. 3 years in Development, and it is worse that when it started. no direction, no Identity, no clue. It's just a big joke.

    I guess Quake Champions it is.

  • #2
    What an original and brave insight you've posted! Very constructive and high quality feedback that will aid Epic enormously in their development of this game. You totally aren't beating a dead horse right now, not in the slightest.

    Seriously, if you don't like the state of the game, just don't play it. In spite of what you might think, there are still plenty of players, both veterans and newcomers, that continue to play UT4 and enjoy it. We acknowledge that it has faults, and aren't always happy with the direction Epic is taking, but the fact that we're still here after several hundred hours of playtime in a pre-alpha shows that there's certainly a strong foundation in this game. At the very least, if you have complaints, post them in a constructive manner rather than just whining about how UT4 is a sad failure that will never get finished. Even if Epic doesn't take them into account, it probably does a lot more for team morale than reading some raging veteran complain about Epic's incompetence.

    As for your specific complaints about hidden weapons and movement, which could have been answered if you took a break from throwing a tantrum long enough to do some of your own research:

    Epic's response to hidden weapons:

    Click image for larger version

Name:	Response.PNG
Views:	1
Size:	64.7 KB
ID:	385007


    Additionally, the movement changes after dodging were reverted this build: https://youtu.be/Lek0UxoQfMQ?t=15s

    If you're leaving for Quake Champions, go right ahead. Just don't let the door hit you on the way out.

    Comment


    • #3
      Yup true, i remember fev months ago i even have fun playing ut but now...

      Comment


      • #4
        Wow... another Cheesecake discussion thread! You all must really love this cake as much as I do.
        Last edited by papercoffee; 04-22-2017, 10:39 AM. Reason: typo... I think...

        .......................................................coffee addicted !!!
        UT99.org + Corporation Logos for UT4

        Comment


        • #5
          Just wanted to comment since i keep seeing these posts everywhere...Im totally noob when it comes to quake or ut so i wont comment on weapon balance,fluidity of movement etc.I can understand if someone prefers quake mechanics over ut's but the netcode in quake is so bad that half of the hits don't register and EVERY rocket fires with a 0.5-0.7 delay.My internet connection isn't the best but i was playing with 70 ping,while in ut i play with 90 ping and i see this problem appear only occasionally.The moment you stop pressing directional keys to move,the character takes a little extra step and many players with very low pings were lagging as hell.I dont know if this has to do with my system but i never met these problems with ut,plus ut is better optimized at the moment.
          I know quake is in beta and i dont say it should be in a perfect state,that's the point of a beta after all.Im just saying that right now ut seems to be in a far better state performance wise, with much more content.
          Sorry for my bad english.

          Comment


          • #6
            Would like weapon switch time decreased significantly. Would like to be able to link with teammates using the plasma secondary. Need grenades back for rocket secondary. Impact hammer back in FFA. Grenade launcher doesn't really fit and its mechanics are lacking. Flak is way overpowered. Flak secondary sounds like a gumball machine. Hard to tell when an armor pickup is there or not there.

            There a not many people playing online, should be gradually increasing not decreasing. Developers should pay close attention to the functionality the community wants and implement that instead of what they think will draw more new people in.

            Comment


            • #7
              Originally posted by Taffy View Post
              Would like weapon switch time decreased significantly. Would like to be able to link with teammates using the plasma secondary. Need grenades back for rocket secondary. Impact hammer back in FFA. Grenade launcher doesn't really fit and its mechanics are lacking. Flak is way overpowered. Flak secondary sounds like a gumball machine. Hard to tell when an armor pickup is there or not there.

              There a not many people playing online, should be gradually increasing not decreasing. Developers should pay close attention to the functionality the community wants and implement that instead of what they think will draw more new people in.
              I agree. There is no one playing. That should tell them something. Suggestions spot on. I would add
              • remove pulse overheat. It's kinda pointless. Perhaps make the projectile larger and slow the firing speed if you want to reduce spam.
              • stinger "warmup speed" thing new to this build isn't working. It's hard enough to get a kill with it compared to other weapons. Maybe, make the barrels a larger circumference and show the firing speed.
              • the three spread rockets just isn't working. they just fly all over. Perhaps make the primary a single fire just increase the firing speed. Also, one rocket should not be able to instagib you. ...and yes, pretty please put grenades back.

              I almost wish at this point they just quit with all the fluffer stuff and get back to basics Scaling, Weapons and Movement. The new taunt animations are neeto and all but there are more important things that need work it seems.

              I have always been an online CTF player. So fun. I used to build maps back in the 99' days. They can be downloaded here.

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by sic1 View Post

                I agree. There is no one playing. That should tell them something. Suggestions spot on. I would add
                • remove pulse overheat. It's kinda pointless. Perhaps make the projectile larger and slow the firing speed if you want to reduce spam.
                • stinger "warmup speed" thing new to this build isn't working. It's hard enough to get a kill with it compared to other weapons. Maybe, make the barrels a larger circumference and show the firing speed.
                • the three spread rockets just isn't working. they just fly all over. Perhaps make the primary a single fire just increase the firing speed. Also, one rocket should not be able to instagib you. ...and yes, pretty please put grenades back.


                I almost wish at this point they just quit with all the fluffer stuff and get back to basics Scaling, Weapons and Movement. The new taunt animations are neeto and all but there are more important things that need work it seems.
                Definitely agree with the pulse overheat and rocket spread issue, been thinking the same thing.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by RodrigoBelacruz3 View Post
                  What an original and brave insight you've posted! Very constructive and high quality feedback that will aid Epic enormously in their development of this game. You totally aren't beating a dead horse right now, not in the slightest.

                  Seriously, if you don't like the state of the game, just don't play it. In spite of what you might think, there are still plenty of players, both veterans and newcomers, that continue to play UT4 and enjoy it. We acknowledge that it has faults, and aren't always happy with the direction Epic is taking, but the fact that we're still here after several hundred hours of playtime in a pre-alpha shows that there's certainly a strong foundation in this game. At the very least, if you have complaints, post them in a constructive manner rather than just whining about how UT4 is a sad failure that will never get finished. Even if Epic doesn't take them into account, it probably does a lot more for team morale than reading some raging veteran complain about Epic's incompetence.

                  As for your specific complaints about hidden weapons and movement, which could have been answered if you took a break from throwing a tantrum long enough to do some of your own research:

                  Epic's response to hidden weapons:
                  Click image for larger version  Name:	Response.PNG Views:	1 Size:	64.7 KB ID:	385007



                  Additionally, the movement changes after dodging were reverted this build: https://youtu.be/Lek0UxoQfMQ?t=15s

                  If you're leaving for Quake Champions, go right ahead. Just don't let the door hit you on the way out.

                  Hi RodrigoBelacruz3,

                  I think you missed the point of my post. this wasn't supposed to be constructive criticism. This post was just a rant of frustration and thats about the only thing you're right about. I wasn't trying to persuade the dev team to do something else. I'm past that point.

                  See this isnt about me either. I've bee involved with Ut since 1999 when the first Ut came out. if you see my Join date in this forum you'll see that I've been active since the beginning. So yes I am very passionate about this game I have built friendships with many people from ut99, ut2k3/4, ut3 etc. all through different communities such as heat.net, IRC, Steam, Xfire, Discord, and different forums such as Prounreal, Beyond Unreal, Etc. So I've been trying to get everyone I know to give this game a try because I always wanted it to succeed. The sad part is that Most of them if not all of them. don't even want to hear the word UT, anymore. Some of them have gone to the length of threatening to block from Steam for even mention that word UT. they don't just don't like the game. they hate Epic altogether.

                  Im' not talking about som random joes here. I'm talking about modders, mappers, professional players, casual active players, and server admins, like Taffy above me. And I am finally starting to understand why.

                  See, I was on the same boat as you, optimistic about things. but just like you I was being a fool. Unfortunately This team does not have a clue of what is doing. this rant isnt about the game not being finished. or the bugs the game has. This ran is about the horribly bad decisions Epic makes. that just shows how disconnected from reality they are. Please tell me: who in their right mind though that messing with the movement after dodging was a good a idea? please do. Because it was not you, not me, obviously NOT the community either since everyone hated it. hence they reverted it back. I remember watching the recap of the update on zucubus video and I remember hearing was "it pains me to tell you that this was done to the game, but I had no say in this. Please don't shoot me I'm just the messenger". So they reverted great. thats not the point. Why was this even considered to begin with is beyond me. It just shows that whoever is charge of making this game doesn't have a clue of what is going on. Like spending time on a new game mode that nobody asked for. infact, why isn't Team Death Match for example being advertised and pushed more? It was never added to Quick play or under featured modes when trying to create game.It was only Duel, Dm and CTF and now Blitz. As result nobody ever plays TDM which is one of the pillars of Arena Shooters. If you play Qukae Champions right now or any other Arena Shooter you'll find that people want to play TDM. TDm is as popular as DM in most of these games. Seriously this has been like assigning a bunch of construction workers to do surgery.

                  So you and maybe Epic can have that attitude of " don't let the door hit ya" but this isn't just me. This is about UT's core fan base. Are you going to say the same to everyone and keep alienating people? see I stuck around for this game as much as I could while I watched hundreds of other people and friends forget about it and it was not because of bugs, or the fact the game still in prealpha, like I mentioned, not, it was because of EPIC's inability to produce something of substance with this project. so if that your answer to everyone " bye bye no one will miss ya'? then I'm sorry. Because lets be honest the real hard cord players are dropping like flies. and the casual players wont stick around either. They hop around from game to game and will forget about this game in a heartbeat. What will you do when you find yourself with less and less players?

                  To me this game has the potential to be very successful, But to be honest, I don't really think Epic cares at all. seems they just pawned off this game to a bunch interns and moved on to other things. Its sad to see your favorite franchise being bastardized like this.


                  Comment


                  • #10
                    There is no way to please all UT fans of real UT 99 and UT2k4 and UT3. UT 2k4 was semi fail allready then UT3 killed serie for 10 years. And here you have problem, UT4 is too similar with UT3, so why would anyone even think about success if UT3 was fail. Are devs thinking that copy UT3 into slightly better engine will be great success? Are they really so short sighted? If you don't have good core then no matter what you do this game will be allways fail. If you think that Epic will support years of development for few hundreds players then you live in fantasy. Even if they spend tens of milions for marketing then this game will fail anyway, becouse the core is rotten and no matter how many game modes are added noone would care.

                    Few points:
                    - movement sux, so copy that from UT99
                    - scaling sux, so copy that from UT99
                    - maps are barely mediocre, something like DM solo and DM lea are awfull and pure nightmare to play
                    - atmosphere sux, there is no concept and every map looks like from different game, the map's layouts are low grade as well, all duel maps sux and it's main reason I don't even try to play or test anymore (Deck is Deck, altough Unreal and UT99 Decks was better, colors, shadow, layout)
                    - there is too much lift jumps, wall jumps and **** like this, casual spectactors may feel sick from it

                    There is much more like gun balance, modes, matchmaking etc. but if you don't fix core issue such as movement, scaling and atmoshere theme, then you don't need to worry about the rest becouse noone will play it anyway.
                    Last edited by Tropheus; 04-22-2017, 02:08 PM.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      No UT past had minimum splash damages.

                      None. I have never ever even seen it suggested it for this franchise. Yet we have them.

                      Not the only issue, but easily one of the easiest examples of what makes some of us wonder what Epic is thinking with some of these changes.

                      Yet the only logical explanations that can be come up with are ignored like the elephant in the room they are.

                      "Why are Rox and Flak so OP? We want balanced weapons! NO DON'T NERF MAH SNIPAZZZ!!!!one."

                      Instate increased collision and minimum splash damage on some projectiles, and people grumble quietly.
                      <insert joker pic>
                      Make the Sniper projectile, and everyone loses their freakin' minds.

                      Most of the game is going to feel like a mess if to achieve any kind of balance Epic is going to have to find ways to make other weapons as high efficacy, easy to use, and have as little counter play as the Sniper rifle, without changing those things about the sniper rifle. Every current issue with the core gameplay right now is subsequent of that, or the fact that we are still clinging on to trying to have native ping compensation. Your hud concerns were explained in the change notes. As a pre-alpha game, I think the last thing we should be wigging out about is interface issues. At least until game play is worth having an interface for.
                      Originally posted by Mysterial
                      An instant hit, accurate, instant kill weapon is overpowered. There's no skill ceiling. It's limited only by the shooter's accuracy. It also severely impairs the defensive side of the game - ignoring ping, it is nearly irrelevant what your opponent does - click the right pixel and you win. Even non-instant kill instant hit weapons are often problematic - the Shock Rifle example is obvious before even getting to other games.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Tropheus View Post
                        There is no way to please all UT fans of real UT 99 and UT2k4 and UT3. UT 2k4 was semi fail allready then UT3 killed serie for 10 years. And here you have problem, UT4 is too similar with UT3, so why would anyone even think about success if UT3 was fail. Are devs thinking that copy UT3 into slightly better engine will be great success? Are they really so short sighted? If you don't have good core then no matter what you do this game will be allways fail. If you think that Epic will support years of development for few hundreds players then you live in fantasy. Even if they spend tens of milions for marketing then this game will fail anyway, becouse the core is rotten and no matter how many game modes are added noone would care.

                        Few points:
                        - movement sux, so copy that from UT99
                        - scaling sux, so copy that from UT99
                        - maps are barely mediocre, something like DM solo and DM lea are awfull and pure nightmare to play
                        - atmosphere sux, there is no concept and every map looks like from different game, the map's layouts are low grade as well, all duel maps sux and it's main reason I don't even try to play or test anymore (Deck is Deck, altough Unreal and UT99 Decks was better, colors, shadow, layout)
                        - there is too much lift jumps, wall jumps and **** like this, casual spectactors may feel sick from it

                        There is much more like gun balance, modes, matchmaking etc. but if you don't fix core issue such as movement, scaling and atmoshere theme, then you don't need to worry about the rest becouse noone will play it anyway.
                        Well 100% agree, and also remove grenade launcher (bring back granades to rocket launcher)

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Sometimes I feel like the only person who actually really likes the grenade launcher. I have an infinitely easier time scoring direct hits with it than with the RL.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Also if epic thinks game is going in good direction let them read QC closed beta forums, it's like hundreds of topics from peps care about game and descibing their feelings, suggestions (and all are saying the same, also not that alot to be improved) and what's the most important 99% of beta participants are having a lot of fun, and saying that gameplay is cool and fun, even if it has so controversary champions idea, overall core gameplay is good, only need some adjustments and fixes.
                            But epic force to their bad ideas so almost no one playing it anymore, and give up on feedback... and to things be more sad there is little to be done to fix this (remove granade launcher and bring it back to rocket launcher, removing linkgun overheating, make movement faster and overall adjustments, also maps are mess, no consistent atmosphere). Overall i think it would be better to just copy UT99 to new engine with adding vehicles
                            Last edited by mar-v-son; 04-24-2017, 12:24 PM.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by Tropheus View Post

                              Few points:
                              - movement sux, so copy that from UT99
                              - scaling sux, so copy that from UT99
                              - maps are barely mediocre, something like DM solo and DM lea are awfull and pure nightmare to play
                              - atmosphere sux, there is no concept and every map looks like from different game, the map's layouts are low grade as well, all duel maps sux and it's main reason I don't even try to play or test anymore (Deck is Deck, altough Unreal and UT99 Decks was better, colors, shadow, layout)
                              - there is too much lift jumps, wall jumps and **** like this, casual spectactors may feel sick from it

                              There is much more like gun balance, modes, matchmaking etc. but if you don't fix core issue such as movement, scaling and atmoshere theme, then you don't need to worry about the rest becouse noone will play it anyway.
                              Thank You for this topic, same feelings here (all the time) exactly ... for many, many UT players and fans.
                              what EPIC is doing ? And what the hell dev's doing ? IT's just no-sense.

                              - tragedy battlefield skins, look at skins on previous ut's - I hate this game about this empty, poor, gaynes, ***** skins - total zero of strong unreal characters.
                              - removed impact hammer was so ... tragedy
                              - removed granades from secondary fire of UT rocket was so ... tragedy
                              - add more ammo of weapons, its no fun when you shoot few times and ammo im empty.

                              Im so bad how EPIC dont know how to make new UT and "their business". I have so many questions and have a lot of anger what's happening with new UT
                              Everything else can be done and fixed, but certainly not going the way where game is now. EPIC WAKE UP and please open your eyes, look at ID ... realy, exactly, its the best time for making some "big".


                              UT - visionary
                              just do it = epic win

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